A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: Best Brown Baggies on November 12, 2011, 11:10:01 PM
-
Hi. I was just reading some more of Mark Knopfler unauthorised biography.
I of course knew about Mark's brother David, but had
forgotten that Mark had a sister called Ruth.
I was just wondering if anyone had any info or pics.
She was born in 1947, 2 years before Mark. David was born
in 53.
The only pic I could find was of her as a child, walking with her
father Erwin.
http://www.google.co.uk/m/search?tbm=isch&hl=en&source=hp&biw=361&bih=469&q=Ruth+knopfler&gbv=2&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=#i=2
All very interesting stuff.
Cheers BBB
-
Found this one of Ruth on the right..and a very young MK on his mother's lap...
(http://s3.amazonaws.com/data.tumblr.com/tumblr_ltwekaxQSa1qg539uo1_1280.jpg?AWSAccessKeyId=AKIAJ6IHWSU3BX3X7X3Q&Expires=1321222360&Signature=6ia7hCaB4GCNiLz1i2VhUkaci3M%3D)
Sorry about the size of the pic. ::)
-
Thanks Hophead. A great pic! :)
Cheers. BBB
-
interesting to see how much David looks like his mum...
-
Absolutely...and Mark looks like Erwin. Hard to tell from this photo though which of the two parents (or brothers) Ruth looks like.
-
I love this pic (saw it first in the "A Life in Songs" bbc documentary). You can already see on this pic that ... Mark is the Boss!!! ;)
LE
-
Here is another one of Ruth (with her Daddy:)
(http://www.chessscotland.com/history/photos/Knopruth_700.jpg)
LE
-
Here is another one of Ruth (with her Daddy:)
(http://www.chessscotland.com/history/photos/Knopruth_700.jpg)
LE
See my initial post! ;D ;)
Cheers BBB
-
ups...
sorry, maybe I should click on a click at least ONCE a week... ;)
LE
-
I remember Mark saying in an itw something like :
"I'm left-handed, and when I was a kid, I mimed guitar playing with a tennis bat, looking at myself in a mirror. And my sister told me : no you're wrong, it's the other way !"
and then, Mark started playing like a right-handed guitarist..... :)
should we thank Ruth ? Or would it have been more fun if Mark had played like Hendrix ? :o
-
We should definitely thank Ruth ;). When you think about it..it seems to make perfect sense that he would use his dexterous hand to roam the fret board..and his other hand to 'claw' at the strings.
-
[quote author=Jean-Fran
-
One a macabre note:
- Did you hear that Mark's sister, Ruth, passed away?
- Oh, deary me! How sad! How does he take it?
- He's become very ruthless.
...
Sorry. Just one of those days.
-
One a macabre note:
- Did you hear that Mark's sister, Ruth, passed away?
- Oh, deary me! How sad! How does he take it?
- He's become very ruthless.
...
Sorry. Just one of those days.
Diificult to believe, but not funny at all. Always feel uncomfortable when I see threads on MK's personal life.
-
Lighten up, mate.
Except for my silly joke (see that word? J - O - K - E), everything discussed in this thread so far is public and factual info, and the pic in question is from a documentary about and approved by Mr K himself. As long as the discussion stays factual, what's the problem of discussing some his private sides?
Besides, nobody forces you to read this anyway.
-
I am aware that it's a joke, but it's not a v funny one! Each to his own sense of humour Jackal.
Just because something may be in the public domain does not, imo, mean that a discussion thread about it is ok. I think someone's personal life should remain personal to them and largely off limits to others and I remain uncomfortable with these threads.Discussions about guitars, tours, songs etc - all perfect and v enjoyable. Just my opinion.
-
I agree with DTB (sounds like a disease ;D), I too am uncomfortable with subjects like this on AMIT, a forum with high standards ;D
but we can't stop people, so I choose not to read them (unless I am really bored, like now ;))
Mind you the discussion about "should we thank Ruth" has its place on this forum IMO as it's about the music. It's a fine line
-
There isn't any law that says: 'You may not discuss Mark Knopflers his personal life'. So I really don't get the point why we should stop this discussion. It's very wrong to implement that kind of censorship imho.
Lars
-
nobody said we should stop it, both DTB and myself said we were uncomfortable with it, that's all.
-
nobody said we should stop it, both DTB and myself said we were uncomfortable with it, that's all.
Bravo Rollergirl! I do believe that such topics are really too close to the line, and sometimes accidentally we could cross it, and that causes great discomfort, and second thoughts about even starting them. The discretion and respect for the private life should never come from obligation or restrictions from the law, but purely out of our good will. Don't do others...thing.
That said, I recognize that Jackal made a joke of poor taste, admitting it at the same time as such, and since he has no previous convictions, should be set free with nothing more than a pat in the wrists. In case he relapse, I suggest lessons from the masters Stephen Fry and Hugh Laurie, our Lord JC (John Cleese and maybe a bit of Rowan Atkinson. That would teach him how to make a good joke. And by the way the secret with jokes is timing.
And Rollergirl, after listening to Kill to get Crimson for at least 10 times (no joke) I declare that it is a fine album, that I like a lot, with only a couple of weak moments. Still not my favourite album, but it was only a matter of repeated listenings. Or is it what they call brainwash. We can never know ;)
-
"The discretion and respect for the private life should never come from obligation or restrictions from the law, but purely out of our good will."
You literally took the words right out of my mouth VGONIS2002. Well said.
-
*sigh*
This is getting ridiculous.
Why shouldn't it be acceptable to discuss a celebrity's private life? As long as it is kept at civilized level, it is not malignant, it is not done to spread false rumors, then what's the deal?
VGONIS2002, what's with the patronizing lesson about how to make a joke? So it wasn't very funny, and the word play was silly, but what was "bad taste" and "wrong timing" about it? To my knowledge, nobody passed away! As a matter of fact, all the comedians you mentioned are all masters of black comedy. It wouldn't surprise if they'd utter a macabre joke in someone's funeral.
Bottom line is, as long as the editors don't deem a thread inappropriate, but certain people get uncomfortable, then don't read it!
-
*sigh*
This is getting ridiculous.
Why shouldn't it be acceptable to discuss a celebrity's private life? As long as it is kept at civilized level, it is not malignant, it is not done to spread false rumors, then what's the deal?
VGONIS2002, what's with the patronizing lesson about how to make a joke? So it wasn't very funny, and the word play was silly, but what was "bad taste" and "wrong timing" about it? To my knowledge, nobody passed away! As a matter of fact, all the comedians you mentioned are all masters of black comedy. It wouldn't surprise if they'd utter a macabre joke in someone's funeral.
Bottom line is, as long as the editors don't deem a thread inappropriate, but certain people get uncomfortable, then don't read it!
Jackal, I was actually saying that it is OK, but you missed the point. Maybe because I was mixing it up with a joke of poor taste at a bad time. And of course I never try to patronize you because I don't like it when somebody else does it to me. I do believe that good intentions is the thing we all have and... oh it doesn't worth it , man.
I am sorry it won't happen again. (FYI, your argument about "being uncomfortable, so don't read" is illogical, but if you don't get it I can't explain)
-
For what it's worth, I don't feel comfortable with this either, purely because Ruth has never, as far as I'm aware, made any public comment or such like about MK. Kitty and even his daughter have featured in the press, but not Ruth.
So I won't be participating, but there's no reason to stop it, unless it's deemed offensive/defamatory etc. :)
Freedom of speech is the whole point of AMIT. That and allowing me to throw my weight around and act like a big man.
-
Jackal, I was actually saying that it is OK, but you missed the point. Maybe because I was mixing it up with a joke of poor taste at a bad time. And of course I never try to patronize you because I don't like it when somebody else does it to me. I do believe that good intentions is the thing we all have and... oh it doesn't worth it , man.
I am sorry it won't happen again. (FYI, your argument about "being uncomfortable, so don't read" is illogical, but if you don't get it I can't explain)
Illogical because you can't be uncomfortable unless you read it, right? I agree if you have a thread with a misleading title or the discussion goes in a different direction (which happens quite often - and this the editors have to deal with), but how can anyone not think that a thread titled "Ruth Knopfler. (Mark's sister)" is going to be personal???
EDIT:
What's illogical is this, "if you don't get it, I can't explain".
-
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o300/reiko7176/motivation/logic.jpg)
(For what it's worth, I don't really understand while it's illogical either, but I'm not very bright.)
-
For what it's worth, I don't feel comfortable with this either, purely because Ruth has never, as far as I'm aware, made any public comment or such like about MK. Kitty and even his daughter have featured in the press, but not Ruth.
So I won't be participating, but there's no reason to stop it, unless it's deemed offensive/defamatory etc. :)
Freedom of speech is the whole point of AMIT. That and allowing me to throw my weight around and act like a big man.
Feel free to feel uncomfortable, big man! :)
Seriously, though, there's nothing in this thread so far that can be deemed inappropriate or prying. BBB just stated some simple basic facts initially, there was an old public photo shown, and a couple of comments made in that regard, plus my silly joke (which was even a digression). How anyone can feel uncomfortable about that, I don't know.
-
(http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o300/reiko7176/motivation/logic.jpg)
(For what it's worth, I don't really understand while it's illogical either, but I'm not very bright.)
The needs of the many..outweigh....oh..screw it ;D
I'm sure that Ruth will never see this anyway
-
Seriously, though, there's nothing in this thread so far that can be deemed inappropriate or prying. BBB just stated some simple basic facts initially, there was an old public photo shown, and a couple of comments made in that regard, plus my silly joke (which was even a digression). How anyone can feel uncomfortable about that, I don't know.
I just think that people that court publicity, and that includes MK - for all his protestations he still pays people to do PR and promoton for him, are fair game. But the family members of someone who ended up famous, who have never themselves tried to get any fame, deserve privacy.
But I'm not going to try and stop the thread. Four years ago I stopped MK when he was walking down a public street with his wife and child and asked him to sign my guitar, so I'm not going to pretend I'm some sort of "holier than thou" guy when it comes to privacy.
-
It is very nice to know details of a more personal nature about your favourite artist. It gives a more humane dimension to a rather distant and only through the art acquaintance. I imagine that it is human nature, rather than curiosity. It certainly doesn't make the music (or whatever art ) better, but it makes it more personal to the listener. So yes, I would go on to read a thread with a title that has such a personal element. I didn't even know that he has a sister, and it makes no difference if you read my comment, prior to this debate we are having. Anyway, I don't even expect from anyone to agree with me, but when you make a comment publicly, I guess I have the right to my opinion. (which by the way, as I told you was a rather poor joke to tame spirits)
Maybe we should start a thread for that sort of matters, or just to get some steam off. ;D Or maybe you keep on that ruthless joke. ;)
-
Blimey!
I wish I hadn't started the thread now.
It was only meant to be a very innocent
bit of interest in one of Mark's siblings.
I must admit though, the more i think about it
to speak about David is probably more ok, bearing
in mind he was part of the history behind Dire Straits.
Ruth has got her own private life, with no cares I'm
sure, to be spoken about on forums.
Maybe this topic should be deleted?
I just thought that maybe a few pics & a little info
on her life, might add another layer to the whole
knopfler family history.
The decision is yours.
Cheers. BBB
-
No, it won't be deleted (throwing my weight around again :) )
-
Blimey!
I wish I hadn't started the thread now.
It was only meant to be a very innocent
bit of interest in one of Mark's siblings.
I must admit though, the more i think about it
to speak about David is probably more ok, bearing
in mind he was part of the history behind Dire Straits.
Ruth has got her own private life, with no cares I'm
sure, to be spoken about on forums.
Maybe this topic should be deleted?
I just thought that maybe a few pics & a little info
on her life, might add another layer to the whole
knopfler family history.
The decision is yours.
Cheers. BBB
Maybe the issue of 'family privacy' is why he stopped playing TOL..too many family memories. That being said...us 'enquiring' minds need to know Dusty...did he sign your guitar?
-
There is nothing illogical in my comment since you understood it Jackal. Logic has levels of understanding. You can't understand 2 if you don't get the concept of 1 or numbers in general. Since you got the logic of my argument there is no need to explain.
But I also like to say that words exist having meanings and purposes. The words on their own are not bad (OK some might blush if I write words describing the genitalia-then again it might be of lust and not shamefulness ;) ). http://youtu.be/ZFD01r6ersw
And when JC said the f word at the memorial of G.Chapman, (that you so beautifully hinted) it was the time and place, but judged after he had said it. For those that all this sound Greek: http://youtu.be/CkxCHybM6Ek. (and an other including Greeks : http://youtu.be/-h20PWliNGk)
And just see this to laugh: http://youtu.be/5VH4c0-p-CY about Germans and their sense of humor. Do Germans or Jewish people laugh with it? It is the concept of the joke not the actual deeper creepy truth it is based upon.
Anyway. As I said it is a nice puzzle to solve: I don't know your mood, I don't know your back ground and kind humor, I don't know you, I can only see what you write. Sometimes, the writing reflects on our own mood and living experiences and that is when everything gets mixed up. As I said, it is all down to good intentions, and the feeling that nobody tries to patronize you. But I thought all these go without saying.
-
No, it won't be deleted (throwing my weight around again :) )
What weight :o :o
-
There is nothing illogical in my comment since you understood it Jackal. Logic has levels of understanding. You can't understand 2 if you don't get the concept of 1 or numbers in general. Since you got the logic of my argument there is no need to explain.
*Nitpicking mode on.*
Whether your comment "If you don't get it, I can't explain it" is illogical or not depends on what the "it"s refer to. If "it" in the first clause means "1" and "it" in the second clause means "1", then your comment means "I can't teach you logic 101 because you don't know logic 101". It also then means that you probably shouldn't seek a career in teaching. Unless of course you consider me a basket case who'll never have a chance of learning anything about logic whatsoever.
If "it" in the first clause means "1" and "it" in the second clause means "2", then your comment means "If you don't get logic 101, I can't teach you logic 202". Which makes perfect sense, but has rather unflattering implications. It makes me look ever so dimwitted and you a trifle arrogant.
The reason I "got your argument", was not because I "got the logic", but simply because you forced me to go back and see what was illogical about mine. Yes, my argument was illogical if it meant the readers could avoid feeling uncomfortable by not reading the thread, but to know what the thread was about would have to read the thread and therefore put themselves at risk of feeling uncomfortable. I just assumed it was understood I was referring to reading the thread title. For someone as intelligent as you (I'm not being sarcastic), I'm a little surprised you didn't get that.
-
Jesus,
I nearly missed the train to work by reading all this... One day off and all kind of things are happening... You cannot be serious about all this, can you?
I think, yes that joke was not a good one, I knew by reading it that it could/would cause some trouble, by all means it was not as good as all the dozens we were able to enjoy from Jackal's since he is a member here, but that also means we should Jackal give some credit for this ... blooper, shouldn't we?
We know him as a man of good taste, good humour and a giant YouTube clip archive, so can we not say "Yes, bad one, never do it again, boy" and off we go to discuss how bad Bob's voice REALLY is??
LE
-
And Rollergirl, after listening to Kill to get Crimson for at least 10 times (no joke) I declare that it is a fine album, that I like a lot, with only a couple of weak moments. Still not my favourite album, but it was only a matter of repeated listenings. Or is it what they call brainwash. We can never know ;)
Well, thank you for giving this album a chance and letting me know about it.
It's not my favourite either but I enjoy it from time to time.
-
Jackal have a nice day. :) I am not in the mood to do this anymore, it is futile and will get as nowhere. The friendly spirit has not left the building, since( I'd like to believe) this was nothing more than a test for logical and illogical teasing. :-\ After all my cover is blown, I have a master in arrogance but miserable failed in logic and pedagogics. :lol And by all means you can have the last word. ;)
-
LE,
Thanks for your flattering words. Don't know if they are deserved or everyone else shares your view, but thank you nevertheless :)
Anyway, what I'm puzzled about is why the joke was what set off this debate! Ok, so the joke was a bit edgy, you might call it poor, but the issue is not the joke, but whether we should discuss Mark's (and other people connected with him) private life.
I suggest any thread on private topics be given a clear, unambigous title so people can know at a glance that the topic will contain information and discussions on someone's private life.
-
That being said...us 'enquiring' minds need to know Dusty...did he sign your guitar?
He sure did. He was "very sweet" about it, had a laugh and a joke with me, couldn't have been nicer. I feel bad that his wife and kid had to wait while he was doing, but I literally saw him walking towards me on the street, I had taken the guitar 500 miles in the hope of getting it signed and I had a split second decision to make.
In the end it was probably the right one, as he didn't meet fans after the event. Not ideal, but he was walking down a public street after all, not like I turned up at his house or anything. :)
-
Jackal have a nice day. :) I am not in the mood to do this anymore, it is futile and will get as nowhere. The friendly spirit has not left the building, since( I'd like to believe) this was nothing more than a test for logical and illogical teasing. :-\ After all my cover is blown, I have a master in arrogance but miserable failed in logic and pedagogics. :lol And by all means you can have the last word. ;)
VGONIS2002, you have a good one too, mate. Sorry for the blowout. I might be argumentative, but I'm not mean-spirited or an a%#hole. So, the friendly spirit has not left the building :)
(I feel a songtitle coming - "The Bitter Taste of the Last Laugh")
-
GROUP HUG!
-
In the end it was probably the right one, as he didn't meet fans after the event.
Hmmmmmmm... ::)
LE
-
You can go on websites like genie and find out all sorts of things about people's families .Its in the public domain.Quite scary actually
-
That being said...us 'enquiring' minds need to know Dusty...did he sign your guitar?
He sure did. He was "very sweet" about it, had a laugh and a joke with me, couldn't have been nicer. I feel bad that his wife and kid had to wait while he was doing, but I literally saw him walking towards me on the street, I had taken the guitar 500 miles in the hope of getting it signed and I had a split second decision to make.
In the end it was probably the right one, as he didn't meet fans after the event. Not ideal, but he was walking down a public street after all, not like I turned up at his house or anything. :)
Great story..and it serves to strengthen my opinion of the man. You can truly tell everyone you have an MK signature guitar (is it a Strat?). I'm sure that Kitty is used to it by now..too bad you didn't have a copy of "Pop" with you for her to sign. :)
-
I am aware that it's a joke, but it's not a v funny one! Each to his own sense of humour Jackal.
Just because something may be in the public domain does not, imo, mean that a discussion thread about it is ok. I think someone's personal life should remain personal to them and largely off limits to others and I remain uncomfortable with these threads.Discussions about guitars, tours, songs etc - all perfect and v enjoyable. Just my opinion.
this thread is approved, and there is no reason to stop it. nothing "evil" was said, no address details were given, no bank account details shared.
-
For what it's worth, I don't feel comfortable with this either, purely because Ruth has never, as far as I'm aware, made any public comment or such like about MK. Kitty and even his daughter have featured in the press, but not Ruth.
So I won't be participating, but there's no reason to stop it, unless it's deemed offensive/defamatory etc. :)
Freedom of speech is the whole point of AMIT. That and allowing me to throw my weight around and act like a big man.
we never approved that last bit dusty...
-
hey......I just wanted to point out : imagine Mark playing like a "real" left-handed guitarist, that's all :o
What I've always founded strange on this forum is to talk over and over about what should be wrote on this forum, instead talking of music (wasn't it the original purpose of this forum ?) :)
english isn't my natural language, but I didn't found Jackal's post schocking. I think jokes are welcome in the discussion, and I agree that nobody is forced to read and reply, and the subject of the topic is limpid : it's about Mark's sister, so of course posts are about her.
If there's a rule of not talking about this kind of subject, why wasn't it deleted immediately ?
Jackal : I like "politically incorrect humour" (yes....googling translation) and it feet well with your avatar ! ;D
-
[quote author=Jean-Fran
-
Dusty, it strikes me as very odd, this story of yours. I mean you probably knew the route MK and co. would pass this day, carrythe guitar with you and waited for them. This must be an MI5 job!
As a matter of fact I carry my guitar all the time, just in case I run into the man - or any man for that matter- but no luck whatsoever. Maybe the fact that I do it in Athens Greece has something to do with it.
When I was in Rhodes island in the army, I was on the look out to see either Gilmour or Wright but no luck either. I also look for Belle and Sebastian, which is such a big group (in number of members-and great musicians from Glasgow-you've heard of them?-) , someone will eventually drop by.
Even Eric Clapton will do...
-
I don't mean to be difficult, but what's the deal with having someone's signature on your guitar? A signature on a CD they have put out or on a photo of them I can get. If the guitar had belonged to them or they had used your guitar for something, it would make sense, but otherwise, I think it's a bit weird :) It's like parking your Toyota Corolla next to Michael Schumacher and go "Yo, Schumee! Would you mind putting your signature on this here car?"
-
You lucky! You have a Toyota! Well it is not actually the same, since Schumacher never drove a Toyota, and after a couple of rains and a bit of sun the signature will go away, but yes the pointless of the whole matter speaks volumes of the lunacy, us, fans and collectors, carry. And yes I like my record sleeves clear of any signature, just for the aesthetics (what's the point in ruining a perfectly balanced-good cover that the artist strive to make?), so for what is worth, I have bought the record again. (Since I am a vinyl "junkie" collector, I try to find as many editions around the world as possible. Unfortunately it is such an expensive hobby, that I can not afford anymore, so the cheaper and easier to collect is the actual LPs, with the tiny differences in details, different colour of letters, inserts, and sometimes like the Korean editions and the Yugoslavian Making movies, different tracklisting!)
-
I don't mean to be difficult, but what's the deal with having someone's signature on your guitar? A signature on a CD they have put out or on a photo of them I can get. If the guitar had belonged to them or they had used your guitar for something, it would make sense, but otherwise, I think it's a bit weird :) It's like parking your Toyota Corolla next to Michael Schumacher and go "Yo, Schumee! Would you mind putting your signature on this here car?"
Dusty got double for his money..if you look closely at the head you'll notice that the guitar is an MK signature Strat..so he has the model...AND Mark's real signature on it as well...cool!! ;)
-
Mark could sign me a napkin anytime. Or a tail pipe.
LE
-
In Amsterdam in 2010, we waited behind the HMH
for the band to arrive. I wasn't expecting to get an autograph,
so wasn't prepared. Anyway, once all the cars drove into the loading
bay, a man came out of a door & said that Mark will sign one item only.
I suddenly panicked, because I didn't have anything!
I quickly looked in my wallet. All I had was a
-
BBB, right on the money! Man your ten pounds now worth 11 for a fan! That is what BD was talking about on Subterranean homesick blues, and after all such bills do exist!
-
Yup, the signature is pretty pointless, no more pointless than a signed CD though. :)