A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Almost Straits => Topic started by: Eddie Fox on May 04, 2023, 06:08:19 PM
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DSL is touring in South America and Brazil is their next stop. To my surprise (or maybe not) the promotion video says ‘Dire Straits, one of the biggest bands of all time…’ in the beginning with some classic tunes in the background. They do say Legacy later but never make it clear it’s not the real thing. I know two people who got tickets thinking it was Dire Straits - obviously not big fans, they know the hits and the name but never heard the name Mark Knopfler before I said it.
I’m not saying it’s the band’s fault but I’m posting it here so they have the chance to do the right thing.
Link to the Instagram post: https://instagram.com/p/CqqrziJAFh9/
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DSL is touring in South America and Brazil is their next stop. To my surprise (or maybe not) the promotion video says ‘Dire Straits, one of the biggest bands of all time…’ in the beginning with some classic tunes in the background. They do say Legacy later but never make it clear it’s not the real thing. I know two people who got tickets thinking it was Dire Straits - obviously not big fans, they know the hits and the name but never heard the name Mark Knopfler before I said it.
I’m not saying it’s the band’s fault but I’m posting it here so they have the chance to do the right thing.
Link to the Instagram post: https://instagram.com/p/CqqrziJAFh9/
That's exactly the reason Mark ended up suing 'em. Or was it another tribute band? Even this is something they messed up. So many name variations and band members that I completely lost track. Funnily enough, Mark's manager Paul Crockford actually manages The Australian Pink Floyd Show, and I never heard about this type of false advertising coming from this band, so it's always a conscious decision. Never liked Legacy guys, never wanted to see them perform live, and never will.
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MK didn't sue them, not any other tribute bands.
He just sent and advise from their lawyers to ask them not confuse the people.
And in the end, are the promoters, the ones more interested in making money from the bands they hire to play, the ones that cause the confusion.
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MK didn't sue them, not any other tribute bands.
He just sent and advise from their lawyers to ask them not confuse the people.
And in the end, are the promoters, the ones more interested in making money from the bands they hire to play, the ones that cause the confusion.
But the band seems OK with it, and the same situation keeps going for years without any changes whatsoever.
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What I like about The Australian Pink Floyd Show is that their name starts with The Australian, so right away you can't be confused with the real thing. Dire Straits Legacy, however, sounds like it's Dire Straits, and false advertising only amplifies this. In my mind, a tribute act can't be named literally just like the artist it pays tribute to, plus maybe a word or two. The Fab Four is probably the best The Beatles tribute band in the world, but it's certainly not The Beatles Legacy.
I'd love to love the band, don't get me wrong, and playing good music is fine, I just don't get the marketing and naming strategy, that's all.
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MK didn't sue them, not any other tribute bands.
He just sent and advise from their lawyers to ask them not confuse the people.
And in the end, are the promoters, the ones more interested in making money from the bands they hire to play, the ones that cause the confusion.
But the band seems OK with it, and the same situation keeps going for years without any changes whatsoever.
As far as I know, they ask the promoters not too confuse people, as they were warned by DS lawyers, but promoters ended doing what they think would work better to sell tickets.
I bet they have contracts where that is written so if the DS lawyers complain they can say it wasn't their fault but the promoters.
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What I like about The Australian Pink Floyd Show is that their name starts with The Australian, so right away you can't be confused with the real thing. Dire Straits Legacy, however, sounds like it's Dire Straits, and false advertising only amplifies this. In my mind, a tribute act can't be named literally just like the artist it pays tribute to, plus maybe a word or two. The Fab Four is probably the best The Beatles tribute band in the world, but it's certainly not The Beatles Legacy.
I'd love to love the band, don't get me wrong, and playing good music is fine, I just don't get the marketing and naming strategy, that's all.
That’s why I posted it here. Maybe the band will see it, you never know. As I said that’d give them the chance to do the right thing. My opinion? They don’t care, as long as it boosts the sales and they are not held accountable it’s happy days.
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What I like about The Australian Pink Floyd Show is that their name starts with The Australian, so right away you can't be confused with the real thing. Dire Straits Legacy, however, sounds like it's Dire Straits, and false advertising only amplifies this. In my mind, a tribute act can't be named literally just like the artist it pays tribute to, plus maybe a word or two. The Fab Four is probably the best The Beatles tribute band in the world, but it's certainly not The Beatles Legacy.
I'd love to love the band, don't get me wrong, and playing good music is fine, I just don't get the marketing and naming strategy, that's all.
That’s why I posted it here. Maybe the band will see it, you never know. As I said that’d give them the chance to do the right thing. My opinion? They don’t care, as long as it boosts the sales and they are not held accountable it’s happy days.
I hope that the problem doesn't go deeper than that. I remember them saying things like "Mark Knopfler wasn't a big part of Dire Straits after all" or something. It's not a verbatim quote, but something along those lines. As if Mark was someone like Cliff Richard with a backing band and not somebody who told everybody what to play and wrote all the songs. So they might as well think of themselves as Dire Straits: Part 2, and hence this questionable marketing.
I really do think, should they be more discreet about their achievements and marketing strategy, Mark wouldn't write such a harsh song about it (Terminal Of Tribute To). And the fact he's still friends with people associated with the project means he's not against that (playing his music) at all. But all this advertising thing, man... It's really unfortunate that Dire Straits LEGACY, please excuse the term, is still in this state.
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My understanding is that Alan believes the songs belong to him too and he has the right to do it. I may be wrong but that’s how it feels. The irony in it is that Marco is just too bad and anyone who sees one of those gigs thinking that’s DS will probably go home extremely disappointed.
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Isn't this old news though? That the DS Legacy (and The Straits too?) were advertised as the real deal in Brazil?
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My understanding is that Alan believes the songs belong to him too and he has the right to do it. I may be wrong but that’s how it feels. The irony in it is that Marco is just too bad and anyone who sees one of those gigs thinking that’s DS will probably go home extremely disappointed.
I don’t think that’s fair to Alan and I’ve been a pretty harsh critic of the various incarnations of the group.
I’d say Alan just looks for acknowledgment that he played a big part in how the songs turned out, which is true.
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My understanding is that Alan believes the songs belong to him too and he has the right to do it. I may be wrong but that’s how it feels. The irony in it is that Marco is just too bad and anyone who sees one of those gigs thinking that’s DS will probably go home extremely disappointed.
I don’t think that’s fair to Alan and I’ve been a pretty harsh critic of the various incarnations of the group.
I’d say Alan just looks for acknowledgment that he played a big part in how the songs turned out, which is true.
I don't know Alan's story in detail, and it's always hard to pretend to be in someone else's shoes. But it reminds me of Simon & Garfunkel's "Battle for Bridge Over Troubled Water" which seemingly divided the duo the most. As Paul wasn't the one who played it live, it was only Art Garfunkel, Paul reportedly became jealous of people thinking it was Art's song. And in response, instead of saying "Here's a new song Paul wrote", Art just said, "Here's our new song". And you have this situation when a songwriter can't perform his own song, and his buddy happens to be the greatest at performing it. What should you do? They settled on war.
These battles of credits and roles in music always seemed too infantile and childish to me, and they probably are. If Alan is so great, then why he doesn't have his own band playing great original material? If his contribution to Mark's music was so enormous, why in the name of love, he wasn't credited as a co-writer? Why he never sued MK for writing credits? But wait a minute, he has his own band playing original material. And their album has 85K plays on Spotify in 6 years.
So in a way, it's just facts showing who's who, and the laws of thermodynamics aren't violated.
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Because one thing is writing a song and another have a big role developing and arranging it
Usually the writer is credited, but not the stranger of all songs, except is something exceptional like hiring and orchestra and needing someone to arrange the strings part, like George Martin did for the OES record.
For example, MK wrote TR, but MK and Alan together arranged it bit by bit. The two of them. Does it means Alan cowrote the song? No. He coarranged it, as most of DS songs since he arrived to the band.
Being good arranging doesn't means you would be awesome writing original great songs. Only that you would be great arranging it.
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Let say that it is common usage that a performer is not just a performer.
Getting credits for more than just performing is something sometime complicated.
You can be paid for but without being credited.
Regarding Alan Clark it is impossible to tell exactly unless you were there during the creative process.
The thing that really question me is what has he done after Dire Straits?
This guy should have been within the most demanded keyboard player and arranger by the top acts but when you look at his CV this is a desert land.
Something happened.
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Let say that it is common usage that a performer is not just a performer.
Getting credits for more than just performing is something sometime complicated.
You can be paid for but without being credited.
Regarding Alan Clark it is impossible to tell exactly unless you were there during the creative process.
The thing that really question me is what has he done after Dire Straits?
This guy should have been within the most demanded keyboard player and arranger by the top acts but when you look at his CV this is a desert land.
Something happened.
Everybody gets what he deserves, I think. Alan deserves recognition and praise for his amazing piano/keyboard work with DS, arranging is the private part of course, but they had no trouble at the time, so they probably settled on something, after all. He's definitely got some money and flying on private jets, but this credit stuff will inevitably be buried under the fame of the end product, unfortunately. The only way to remedy that is to create something equally great or work with somebody as great as MK, no other way. You're right, something happened, and his post-DS works won't knock anyone's socks off. He's obviously extremely talented and professional but probably struggled to find an artist as good as DS to the point of playing their material to make a living.
To think of it, few musicians barely survived DS in a good way. Apart from Guy Fletcher, who is THE luckiest guy in the world, continuing working with MK to this day, and John Illsley, who literally owned DS with MK, others weren't as lucky. David gathers money on his albums on Patreon like me (and I'm nobody!), Pick's career is extremely low-key, Jack Sonny is known as "the other guitar in Dire Straits", and so on. That's why I'd think twice before joining an act like DS.
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Can't believe I'm defending Alan Clark but it seems that's where we are!
In his defence, I don't think he ever claimed to have written any of the songs.
Jack had a good career outwith music to be fair, the Line 6 Pod was a huge success. And Hal has a successful tv soundtrack career.
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Apparently any musician that was in DS was nobody before joining and was nobody after leaving.
The world is DS centered.
LOL
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Apparently any musician that was in DS was nobody before joining and was nobody after leaving.
The world is DS centered.
LOL
Wrong. The world is Ukraine-centered LOL. But jokes aside, I don't get why you need to "defend" Alan and defend from what exactly. I praise his work for DS, he's overall great, but his DS tribute work is questionable. And I actually love his latest solo album, this is what you would call a proper tribute — solo piano playing, doing what you do best.
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Apparently any musician that was in DS was nobody before joining and was nobody after leaving.
The world is DS centered.
LOL
Wrong. The world is Ukraine-centered LOL. But jokes aside, I don't get why you need to "defend" Alan and defend from what exactly. I praise his work for DS, he's overall great, but his DS tribute work is questionable. And I actually love his latest solo album, this is what you would call a proper tribute — solo piano playing, doing what you do best.
Actually Alan had a career before DS and after DS, maybe not big names, except Clapton, but he kept working as a musician after DS and already was working as a musician before DS, he played with Brian Johnson in Geordie!
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I think the general point stands though, that for just about every musician who was involved in DS, being in DS was the peak of their career.
Tommy Mandel would be a notable exception, having a long and successful career in Bryan Adams' band when he was one of the biggest acts in the world.
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I think the general point stands though, that for just about every musician who was involved in DS, being in DS was the peak of their career.
Tommy Mandel would be a notable exception, having a long and successful career in Bryan Adams' band when he was one of the biggest acts in the world.
Mark also had a career after DS and a very successful one. If he won't succeed, DS would still be playing and releasing albums, no doubt about it.
Being a professional musician is a hard job to do, so I can't possibly critique anybody. It's truly hard to make a living in this profession, make a name for oneself and acquire some reputation, putting in decades and decades of work, with little to no recognition except from a very narrow circle of professionals. Or, like in Alan's case, effectively making half (or 25%) of the work, and getting no credits at all except liner notes. It hurts! I'd hate to be a professional musician.
But if you look at it from the other side, you're making history and recordings that will be heard for hundreds, if not thousands of years into the future. Certainly, Mark's music will be around as long as Earth is still around, so not bad. Eric Clapton and AC/DC are also household names, can't complain here either.
Sometimes, like Guy, or Sting's guitar player Dominic Miller, you get extremely lucky while enjoying the greatest job and no excessive fame at the same time.
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I personally think it's extremely unlikely that people will be listening to DS or in fact any other 20th century music in hundreds of years. I won't be around to find out either, but generally even the biggest phenomenons get forgotten about within two or three generations.
Bing Crosby was a global superstar for a couple of decades but is more or less forgotten now. Young people will know White Christmas but they couldn't tell you who sang it.
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I think the general point stands though, that for just about every musician who was involved in DS, being in DS was the peak of their career.
Tommy Mandel would be a notable exception, having a long and successful career in Bryan Adams' band when he was one of the biggest acts in the world.
Both Alan and Phil say their peak was playing with Eric Clapton, in fact they both had second thoughts leaving Eric's band to go to DS but Alan had not option as it was his band at the time and Phil was told that because of Eric's son death, he won't be playing and he should take any job offered.
Actually Phil continued playing for big names, like George Michael, Seal, everyone in Italy...
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I think the general point stands though, that for just about every musician who was involved in DS, being in DS was the peak of their career.
Tommy Mandel would be a notable exception, having a long and successful career in Bryan Adams' band when he was one of the biggest acts in the world.
Both Alan and Phil say their peak was playing with Eric Clapton, in fact they both had second thoughts leaving Eric's band to go to DS but Alan had not option as it was his band at the time and Phil was told that because of Eric's son death, he won't be playing and he should take any job offered.
Actually Phil continued playing for big names, like George Michael, Seal, everyone in Italy...
Good point, forgot about Phil. Chris Whitten as well, McCartney was surely his peak.
Alan might say that in terms of enjoyment but any logical assessment would show that a 10 year run with Dire Straits at their commercial peak is a bigger achievement than a couple of tours with Clapton.
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
Playing with EC you're really just doing a load of covers and songs written by somebody else. ;D
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
Playing with EC you're really just doing a load of covers and songs written by somebody else. ;D
As Tina Turner or Joe Cocker, and a bunch of other great performers.
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
Playing with EC you're really just doing a load of covers and songs written by somebody else. ;D
And?
You are playing with a legend!
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
Playing with EC you're really just doing a load of covers and songs written by somebody else. ;D
And?
You are playing with a legend!
We're not saying that playing with DS is the highlight of their careers because we are a bunch of dumb fanboys, but because each time you realistically try to compare the careers you come to this conclusion. George Michael, Seal, and Eric Clapton are all great legends, but obviously, Mark is more prolific as a songwriter, more consistent as a songwriter, and more unique as a guitar player even. It's not as bluesy as Eric, it's not as pop as George or Seal. It's a completely different League of Legends on its own. I would kill to play Mark's songs live with him, to be honest, but Eric? I won't even think about it.
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Yeah, but in rock and roll terms, Clapton was bigger than DS, he's a legend know by everyone, he's in the same league of legends like Dylan for example. Dire Straits was a band who was successful in their time but I don't think they were in the super league of rock.
Playing with Clapton and Dylan during the BIA tour was for sure one of the best moments for any of the DS musicians, MK included
All true, but I don't think playing a handful of gigs with Dylan or a couple of tours with Clapton could be considered Alan's career peak compared to a decade at the top with DS, including when they were the biggest band in the world, Live Aid, Mandela, US number one single etc.
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Don’t wanna sound to harsh on him but if we don’t know what was Alan’s peak we sure know his valley is now…
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Alan is currently working a lot as a studio musician with Trevor Horn, so he is not in his peak but still very busy in his profession and from time to time playing with DSL in which he is, don't forget about it, Marco Caviglia's band and all the rest are paid musicians doing their job, which is playing music.
So it is still work, not in any valley but following the stream, or his "walk of life",lol.
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Don’t wanna sound to harsh on him but if we don’t know what was Alan’s peak we sure know his valley is now…
Lols. As jbaent says, he's doing OK for a 70-odd year old musician. As Alan himself says, he's never worked a day in his life in a "real job" - that's the way you do it!
The strange thing for me is that he kind of went under the radar in the 90s, you would think with a CV that read Clapton's musical director/arranger for Dire Straits he would have had some big gigs at that time.
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Don’t wanna sound to harsh on him but if we don’t know what was Alan’s peak we sure know his valley is now…
Lols. As jbaent says, he's doing OK for a 70-odd year old musician. As Alan himself says, he's never worked a day in his life in a "real job" - that's the way you do it!
The strange thing for me is that he kind of went under the radar in the 90s, you would think with a CV that read Clapton's musical director/arranger for Dire Straits he would have had some big gigs at that time.
I guess, not every musician is suitable for everything. If Mark Knopfler is great at playing the guitar, it doesn't automatically mean he would be a great studio musician, which he told a million times in interviews himself. It's a completely different skill set, mindset, and everything else set. A studio musician is somebody who works ALL THE TIME, like Hal Blaine.
As for never working a day on a real job — that's utter bullshit, sorry. Only people with psychological traumas and complexes could say that. Same as in Russia, it's considered bad to "work for a dude", as opposed to working on your own business, and you can often find businessmen in Russia who say they never even think about working for somebody.
If you never worked on a real job, then you don't know what life is, as simple as that. Go work on a farm, work as a paperboy, dig graves, go to the office from 8 to 6, and move furniture and audio equipment. I've had a fair share of bad and "real" jobs in my life, and I wouldn't trade this experience for anything.
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Don’t wanna sound to harsh on him but if we don’t know what was Alan’s peak we sure know his valley is now…
Lols. As jbaent says, he's doing OK for a 70-odd year old musician. As Alan himself says, he's never worked a day in his life in a "real job" - that's the way you do it!
The strange thing for me is that he kind of went under the radar in the 90s, you would think with a CV that read Clapton's musical director/arranger for Dire Straits he would have had some big gigs at that time.
I read or heard Alan in an interview telling that after DS and Clapton band he was tired of touring and playing in that high level and he decided to stay working low profile, recording music for TV and doing sessions here and there.
Also Chris Whitten said something like that, in fact he moved to Australia to work on TV things after being with Macca and DS.
Looks like after climbing that peaks, they were exhausted and needed some lower demanding work.
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Only people with psychological traumas and complexes could say that.
This is quite the leap.
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Don’t wanna sound to harsh on him but if we don’t know what was Alan’s peak we sure know his valley is now…
Lols. As jbaent says, he's doing OK for a 70-odd year old musician. As Alan himself says, he's never worked a day in his life in a "real job" - that's the way you do it!
The strange thing for me is that he kind of went under the radar in the 90s, you would think with a CV that read Clapton's musical director/arranger for Dire Straits he would have had some big gigs at that time.
I guess, not every musician is suitable for everything. If Mark Knopfler is great at playing the guitar, it doesn't automatically mean he would be a great studio musician, which he told a million times in interviews himself. It's a completely different skill set, mindset, and everything else set. A studio musician is somebody who works ALL THE TIME, like Hal Blaine.
As for never working a day on a real job — that's utter bullshit, sorry. Only people with psychological traumas and complexes could say that. Same as in Russia, it's considered bad to "work for a dude", as opposed to working on your own business, and you can often find businessmen in Russia who say they never even think about working for somebody.
If you never worked on a real job, then you don't know what life is, as simple as that. Go work on a farm, work as a paperboy, dig graves, go to the office from 8 to 6, and move furniture and audio equipment. I've had a fair share of bad and "real" jobs in my life, and I wouldn't trade this experience for anything.
It does mean that if you work in something you love, doesn't feel like work, but pleasure you are being paid for.
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Yeah, there's a saying in English, find a job that you love and you'll never work a day in your life. :)
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Yeah, there's a saying in English, find a job that you love and you'll never work a day in your life. :)
This is absolutely true, but it's not "never working on a real job". Mark worked on a normal and dirty job, for more than a day, and still eventually found his dream job. There's ambiguity about it: if never worked a day on a real job = always worked as a musician, then this is strange. What kind of a genius you are to all your life work as a musician? Teach me your ways, dude! If it means you found your dream job, that's good. Billions of people work on "normal" jobs, and by saying that you never were a part of this lousy crowd, you diminish everybody else's work and put yourself above people.
I might be too harsh on Alan, but he did everything he could to build this legacy (again, please excuse the term) for himself, when everything he says or does should be taken with a grain of salt. Maybe, this lack of experience in life (never working on "real" jobs, for instance) can actually lead to all these decisions he made. But I'll never like the guy, no matter what. But I always, however, praise his piano work.
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Yeah, there's a saying in English, find a job that you love and you'll never work a day in your life. :)
This is absolutely true, but it's not "never working on a real job". Mark worked on a normal and dirty job, for more than a day, and still eventually found his dream job. There's ambiguity about it: if never worked a day on a real job = always worked as a musician, then this is strange. What kind of a genius you are to all your life work as a musician? Teach me your ways, dude! If it means you found your dream job, that's good. Billions of people work on "normal" jobs, and by saying that you never were a part of this lousy crowd, you diminish everybody else's work and put yourself above people.
I might be too harsh on Alan, but he did everything he could to build this legacy (again, please excuse the term) for himself, when everything he says or does should be taken with a grain of salt. Maybe, this lack of experience in life (never working on "real" jobs, for instance) can actually lead to all these decisions he made. But I'll never like the guy, no matter what. But I always, however, praise his piano work.
As Dusty says, it's just a say, not to be taken literally.
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Re Alan, I meant playing with this band. It’s morally degrading imho. Still a great musician though, I’m sure his inbox is always full.
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They are playing Alicante this summer, I already have my tickets.
Sadly it is true is the closer you are going to get to see DS, with MK retired and having Alan Clark and Mel Collins in the band, plus Danny and Phil from the hired guns of the OES, not any other tribute would be closer, in names, to the band.
In sound, most of the Spanish tribute bands (Great Straits, Real Straits or Alchemy tribute band) are musically superior as a band.
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They are playing Alicante this summer, I already have my tickets.
Sadly it is true is the closer you are going to get to see DS, with MK retired and having Alan Clark and Mel Collins in the band, plus Danny and Phil from the hired guns of the OES, not any other tribute would be closer, in names, to the band.
In sound, most of the Spanish tribute bands (Great Straits, Real Straits or Alchemy tribute band) are musically superior as a band.
That's why, I think, "original" musicians should never play in tribute bands. Come on, tribute bands are supposed to be made by fans, for fans.
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They are playing Alicante this summer, I already have my tickets.
Sadly it is true is the closer you are going to get to see DS, with MK retired and having Alan Clark and Mel Collins in the band, plus Danny and Phil from the hired guns of the OES, not any other tribute would be closer, in names, to the band.
In sound, most of the Spanish tribute bands (Great Straits, Real Straits or Alchemy tribute band) are musically superior as a band.
That's why, I think, "original" musicians should never play in tribute bands. Come on, tribute bands are supposed to be made by fans, for fans.
I think so too.
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Tribute bands only need to be good, regardless of who is actually playing.
I have no problem with ex members being hired in tribute bands.
Remember that Phil Palmer is a pro musician.
That means he is looking for jobs to make his living.
Playing in a tribute band is a job.
IMHO where much of DS tibute bands are wrong is that they doesn't hire a good singer.
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A lot of the people in the tribute bands aren't necessarily fans of the music.
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A lot of the people in the tribute bands aren't necessarily fans of the music.
Most of them are just hired musicians or even sometimes even the "owners" aren't fans, just people that like the money they make with the tribute
Personally I prefer tribute bands where at least the leader is a fan, it adds a piece of love to the tribute that makes it more honest that just milking the cow but, if the attendance enjoy it, good for them, that's what's important in the end, because everyone has to work to pay the bills.
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A lot of the people in the tribute bands aren't necessarily fans of the music.
Most of them are just hired musicians or even sometimes even the "owners" aren't fans, just people that like the money they make with the tribute
Personally I prefer tribute bands where at least the leader is a fan, it adds a piece of love to the tribute that makes it more honest that just milking the cow but, if the attendance enjoy it, good for them, that's what's important in the end, because everyone has to work to pay the bills.
Well, it actually makes sense, because a fan won't stand butchering of his beloved songs on stage, which is often the case. Hiring a singer is a good idea, tho if you're trying to imitate MK, you need to be a good singer AND guitar player, which is a tall order. And makes you appreciate his work even more!
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A lot of the people in the tribute bands aren't necessarily fans of the music.
Most of them are just hired musicians or even sometimes even the "owners" aren't fans, just people that like the money they make with the tribute
Personally I prefer tribute bands where at least the leader is a fan, it adds a piece of love to the tribute that makes it more honest that just milking the cow but, if the attendance enjoy it, good for them, that's what's important in the end, because everyone has to work to pay the bills.
Well, it actually makes sense, because a fan won't stand butchering of his beloved songs on stage, which is often the case. Hiring a singer is a good idea, tho if you're trying to imitate MK, you need to be a good singer AND guitar player, which is a tall order. And makes you appreciate his work even more!
And again I agree :)
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I newly have heard about that band, called Dire Straits Legacy. :think
That are three Italian musicians together with Alan Clark, Jack Sonni, Mel Collins, Danny Cummings, Phil Palmer and the former well known music-producer and "The Buggles" musician Trevor Horn.
I don´t know that Italian guys allready, but i think it is possible, that they are DS and MK fans and are able to do an adäquate job on stage. What do you think, is that "All Star-Band" worth to listen to, and to visit their concerts? In September, they are in Germany for 4 shows, incl. Cologne. Ticket-prices around 60 Euro. :think 8)
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I newly have heard about that band, called Dire Straits Legacy. :think
That are three Italian musicians together with Alan Clark, Jack Sonni, Mel Collins, Danny Cummings, Phil Palmer and the former well known music-producer and "The Buggles" musician Trevor Horn.
I don´t know that Italian guys allready, but i think it is possible, that they are DS and MK fans and are able to do an adäquate job on stage. What do you think, is that "All Star-Band" worth to listen to, and to visit their concerts? In September, they are in Germany for 4 shows, incl. Cologne. Ticket-prices around 60 Euro. :think 8)
Marco, the MK impersonator (in a very good way), had an DS official cover band called Solid Rock many years ago.
Marco also had some gigs with Steve Phillips on Italy.
He is a nice and funny guy.
He is living a dream playing with Alan and the other former Straits members.
I miss Alan playing with MK.
I think that, if Mark had choosen Alan instead of Guy, his solo career was different musically speaking.
But Alan was a huge part of the Straits sound, so if Mark had choosen him, i think that MK's solo career would be too much close from the DS.
Nothing against Guy, for Gods seak.
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I'm not sure, I think the music would have still gone the way MK wanted it to. He is always in charge. Alan was there for OES and it still had country leanings. He wasn't there for Golden Heart which still had some rockers.
Personally I'm pleased that MK solo isn't just a rehash of DS...
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I miss Alan playing with MK.
I think that, if Mark had choosen Alan instead of Guy, his solo career was different musically speaking.
But Alan was a huge part of the Straits sound, so if Mark had choosen him, i think that MK's solo career would be too much close from the DS.
Nothing against Guy, for Gods seak.
I have often wished for Alan instead of Guy, but I think Mark wanted a yes man and sounding board for his solo career. I'm sure you're right regarding the DS sound too.
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I miss Alan playing with MK.
I think that, if Mark had choosen Alan instead of Guy, his solo career was different musically speaking.
But Alan was a huge part of the Straits sound, so if Mark had choosen him, i think that MK's solo career would be too much close from the DS.
Nothing against Guy, for Gods seak.
+1 :thumbsup
I have often wished for Alan instead of Guy, but I think Mark wanted a yes man and sounding board for his solo career. I'm sure you're right regarding the DS sound too.
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If Mark had picked Alan instead of Guy they’d have split again very quickly hahaha
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Wow! Apparently, Dire Straits Legacy are going to play in Russia this December. In an interesting cruel joke, while Mark cancelled his show there 10 years ago, ahead of any Russophobia around the world, these guys go ahead and want to play in this "Promised Land". I can't even return to my own country and be safe, and this group has no problem with that. If that is true, then I would advise anyone to boycott their shows.
By the way, I remember this show cancelling debate sparked a lot of hatred and people leaving the forum, including me, but at the time, in this context, I was against this decision from MK. It's easy to support it now, knowing all that happened, though. Let's just say Mark was ahead of time. Now it makes sense.
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Apparently?
Asking for a boicot with an apparently doesn't seems fair.
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
Thank you. I just saw the news on a Russian website and couldn't find it on any foreign website. I do hope they'll change that.
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Apparently?
Asking for a boicot with an apparently doesn't seems fair.
I said apparently not because I'm not sure about the show, I knew the date, but because I just couldn't believe it. Seems like it was maybe a glitch in the system or something and a show that was planned a couple of years ago, or else it just blows my mind on multiple levels.
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Wow! Apparently, Dire Straits Legacy are going to play in Russia this December. In an interesting cruel joke, while Mark cancelled his show there 10 years ago, ahead of any Russophobia around the world, these guys go ahead and want to play in this "Promised Land". I can't even return to my own country and be safe, and this group has no problem with that. If that is true, then I would advise anyone to boycott their shows.
By the way, I remember this show cancelling debate sparked a lot of hatred and people leaving the forum, including me, but at the time, in this context, I was against this decision from MK. It's easy to support it now, knowing all that happened, though. Let's just say Mark was ahead of time. Now it makes sense.
Oh, and guess what. I'm already being contacted by Russian people asking whether it's really Dire Straits with Mark Knopfler or not. I can't blame the people for the lack of information or skills to find it, but I will blame the band for all it's worth.
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
No sense. Dire Straits legacy title and DS photo from 1978. Why is such a signal and photo going out into the world... I won't be nervous.
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
No sense. Dire Straits legacy title and DS photo from 1978. I won't be nervous.
So, are you implying that somebody's trying to fake a show of a tribute band? Who on Earth can benefit from something like that?
And the link to buy tickets leads to Yandex Afisha, which is like one of the biggest tickets aggregators in Russia, certainly with approved shows.
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I'm not suggesting anything. The photo is wrong and that's it.
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
No sense. Dire Straits legacy title and DS photo from 1978. I won't be nervous.
So, are you implying that somebody's trying to fake a show of a tribute band? Who on Earth can benefit from something like that?
And the link to buy tickets leads to Yandex Afisha, which is like one of the biggest tickets aggregators in Russia, certainly with approved shows.
Journalist nowadays are lazy, probably they search internet and put the first picture they found.
Also promoters wants to sell tickets so they would sell more if they out a picture like that.
Same old story.
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Apparently?
Asking for a boicot with an apparently doesn't seems fair.
I said apparently not because I'm not sure about the show, I knew the date, but because I just couldn't believe it. Seems like it was maybe a glitch in the system or something and a show that was planned a couple of years ago, or else it just blows my mind on multiple levels.
The date is not on their site, let's say "yet"
http://www.dslegacy.com/dsllive-tour/
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https://myrockshows.com/band/5556-dire-straits/country/52-russia/
No sense. Dire Straits legacy title and DS photo from 1978. I won't be nervous.
So, are you implying that somebody's trying to fake a show of a tribute band? Who on Earth can benefit from something like that?
And the link to buy tickets leads to Yandex Afisha, which is like one of the biggest tickets aggregators in Russia, certainly with approved shows.
There are 2 pictures
The one on the top is DS but below the one on the All upcoming events section is featuring DSLegacy on it.
And when you click on the link (https://myrockshows.com/event/725141-dire-straits-legacy-restoran-alpenkhaus/) this is the same DSL picture
This add is problably some fake news from the FSB ;D or these guys are completly nuts :thumbsdown
Or...
Ukrain win the war
Putin resigns
Democratics elections take part in Russia
All that before december 7 2023 :clap
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
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I think Mark had success outside of DS. Have musicians from tribute bands been successful?
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
:clap
Totally agree.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
Being in a famous band is a peak for almost anyone, whether it's some Russian band, The Beatles, The Police, or anyone else. The power of the brand is always bigger than the power of the individual. What you do after this peak is another question... Mark and Sting were principal songwriters, so they can just continue doing what they were doing already with different musicians, which is more or less what happened.
Other musicians are almost guaranteed to fall into this tribute thing at some point or another. How you deal with it is the main challenge. I like how Steward Copeland instead of creating just another tribute band put out a show with an orchestra and 3 great singers "replacing" Sting and playing The Police songs. That's creative and original.
What was the problem for me and for a lot of people I know, was that DSL is just too simple of a concept. No imagination is needed. Take a great band with one of the most unique, irreplicable, and charismatic leaders who lead the band from a humble 4-piece outfit to an orchestra through his 60 songs, replace him, then find a couple of musicians who apparently made a solid impact on the band, and tour with it.
But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go. I'd rather leave tributes for non-band musicians and have Alan Clark touring with solo piano recitals playing DS music, than having this Frankenstein's monster of tribute bands, "original" "band members", former music legends and questionable marketing.
-
A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
Being in a famous band is a peak for almost anyone, whether it's some Russian band, The Beatles, The Police, or anyone else. The power of the brand is always bigger than the power of the individual. What you do after this peak is another question... Mark and Sting were principal songwriters, so they can just continue doing what they were doing already with different musicians, which is more or less what happened.
Other musicians are almost guaranteed to fall into this tribute thing at some point or another. How you deal with it is the main challenge. I like how Steward Copeland instead of creating just another tribute band put out a show with an orchestra and 3 great singers "replacing" Sting and playing The Police songs. That's creative and original.
What was the problem for me and for a lot of people I know, was that DSL is just too simple of a concept. No imagination is needed. Take a great band with one of the most unique, irreplicable, and charismatic leaders who lead the band from a humble 4-piece outfit to an orchestra through his 60 songs, replace him, then find a couple of musicians who apparently made a solid impact on the band, and tour with it.
But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go. I'd rather leave tributes for non-band musicians and have Alan Clark touring with solo piano recitals playing DS music, than having this Frankenstein's monster of tribute bands, "original" "band members", former music legends and questionable marketing.
Well said! :clap
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
I might just agree with you if they were touring playing their own songs, but they are playing MK's songs with an Italian singer/guitarist! Also regarding preferring to lift people up rather than tearing them down, you are doing the very best you can to tear MK down and he is the one who wrote all of the songs. Unbelievable! Without MK's songs DSL would be nowhere!
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
I might just agree with you if they were touring playing their own songs, but they are playing MK's songs with an Italian singer/guitarist! Also regarding preferring to lift people up rather than tearing them down, you are doing the very best you can to tear MK down and he is the one who wrote all of the songs! Unbelievable!
:thumbsup
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I still think that to put a good DS cover band you need a really good singer (or hire Mark himself ;D ).
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I still think that to put a good DS cover band you need a really good singer (or hire Mark himself ;D ).
:thumbsup
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I still think that to put a good DS cover band you need a really good singer (or hire Mark himself ;D ).
That's very important really.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
I respect Richard as a guitarist and for his career but the 96ers have never been capable of reproducing a rock and roll sound like any DS incarnation. Perhaps the main reason we haven't heard Private Investigations or TOL from them is that they sound more pipe and slippers than rock and roll.
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I think Mark had success outside of DS. Have musicians from tribute bands been successful?
Success is relative. Given that he was the front man of DS and the only celebrity member because of that, it's not all that impressive. Maybe he doesn't care about the charts - but then again, who says the others do? I could easily see any musician, big name or not, doing it for the passion of the art rather than trying to "play the hitmaker game". And I think MK and the other DS members who made albums should be treated in the same fashion here.
If success is reflected by sales, MK has the best solo career - no doubt - but it's still nothing compared to the band Dire Straits, so we would have to admit it went downhill - bigtime - for everyone in that case. If success is not reflected by sales, then you need a different measurement. And "I like MK better" is not an objective criteria for success.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
The same applies to the ex-DS-band members AFAIK. Sure, there are exceptions, but most of them are known for other things, also. And if you choose to step down from making music, then that's fair game, also.
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
Being in a famous band is a peak for almost anyone, whether it's some Russian band, The Beatles, The Police, or anyone else. The power of the brand is always bigger than the power of the individual. What you do after this peak is another question... Mark and Sting were principal songwriters, so they can just continue doing what they were doing already with different musicians, which is more or less what happened.
Other musicians are almost guaranteed to fall into this tribute thing at some point or another. How you deal with it is the main challenge. I like how Steward Copeland instead of creating just another tribute band put out a show with an orchestra and 3 great singers "replacing" Sting and playing The Police songs. That's creative and original.
What was the problem for me and for a lot of people I know, was that DSL is just too simple of a concept. No imagination is needed. Take a great band with one of the most unique, irreplicable, and charismatic leaders who lead the band from a humble 4-piece outfit to an orchestra through his 60 songs, replace him, then find a couple of musicians who apparently made a solid impact on the band, and tour with it.
But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go. I'd rather leave tributes for non-band musicians and have Alan Clark touring with solo piano recitals playing DS music, than having this Frankenstein's monster of tribute bands, "original" "band members", former music legends and questionable marketing.
It might be that the tribute bands would be better off doing the "MK and the 96ers approach", which is to play some DS songs together with their own solo material. I mean, who knows, right?
MK is "looking forward only", but still insisted on playing DS songs despite all the solo tracks he could choose from. It's tempting to say his solo carreer is a "DS tribute band light" ;D. The big difference is that they never claimed to be a tribute band. That said, he has been branded as "the voice and guitar of Dire Straits", which sounds an awful lot like the same tricks the tribute bands try to pull.
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A couple of remarks after reading this thread:
I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
And sure, it's fun to speculate about "the valley of Alan Clarks carreer". And then you listen to MFN from the 2019 tour, and realize that there are more people that might be down in the valley somewhere. Or even the albums. They're just not even close to as good as they were around 1996-2005.
Personally, I prefer to lift people up rather than tearing them down - but make no mistake. Just because we're on a MK fan forum, that doesn't mean you can't treat him like one of the tribute band guys and slap him around a bit. I like equal treatment :)
(and given the state of Mark nowadays, even if he had toured, you'd probably get a better DS sound elsewhere, anyway. It's like he's 15 years older than all the other guys.)
I might just agree with you if they were touring playing their own songs, but they are playing MK's songs with an Italian singer/guitarist! Also regarding preferring to lift people up rather than tearing them down, you are doing the very best you can to tear MK down and he is the one who wrote all of the songs. Unbelievable! Without MK's songs DSL would be nowhere!
I'm well aware of the fact that I'm playing the same game. But then others might see how it looks and feels when people do exactly that, and hopefully learn from that experience. If you find it unpleasant, then remember that others might feel the same the next time Alan Clark or someone else is treated disrespectfully. And as I wrote in a different reply: although MK did play alot of his solo material live, he also included alot of DS songs. There's no reason why it's fine for HIM to do it, and not the others. Those who contributed to it, deserve to be allowed to play it live without being shamed for it.
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That’s not the point here, at least not mine.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
I respect Richard as a guitarist and for his career but the 96ers have never been capable of reproducing a rock and roll sound like any DS incarnation. Perhaps the main reason we haven't heard Private Investigations or TOL from them is that they sound more pipe and slippers than rock and roll.
Mark's solo band was never intended to be a rock and roll band. That was one of the reasons he ended DS - he wanted to play the kind of songs he wanted to play and so he searched for the most accomplished musicians he could find who could do that. In my opinion he did an excellent job. This band can play just about anything that is required of them and is certainly not a pipe and slippers band!
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I'm sure DS was the peak of many band member's careers as musicians. But, although nobody has said it out loud yet, that also applies to Mark. Which might indicate something about the team effort in the DS project, that the contributions made by the others were actually quite important. If not, then why aren't the 96ers as successful? We can always laugh at the works of the old band members who are in tribute bands now, but it's not hard to look at the charts and realize that one should thread carefully - despite MK having a momentum from his name only the others can't match, not much of his solo stuff is appreciated outside of our little bubble. STP is the one exception, and MAYBE GH (but that could just as well be "leftover momentum" from BIA, just like OES sold way more than it deserved because people expected it to be as good as BIA).
I disagree. MK's solo career has been unbelievably successful. He has released music that is markedly less commercial than DS, ie folky/country/celtic tinged stuff, dropped virtually all of the songs that made him successful, and right up to 2019 was still filling the kind of venues he would be filling if he had kept DS going (he plays similar sized venues to Clapton for example).
I genuinely think that many of his peers must look at him, filling arenas playing new, uncommercial material and being very jealous, wondering how he pulled that off when they are still playing the same greatest hits they have played for 50 years.
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But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go.
The project hasn't failed, the project was to earn a living going out playing DS songs, they have done that and it has been highly successful. They play some massive shows.
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But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go.
The project hasn't failed, the project was to earn a living going out playing DS songs, they have done that and it has been highly successful. They play some massive shows.
I won't say to earn a living as far as most of them are session players currently working, quite a lot under Trevor Horn wings and different Italian producers and artists, I would say they do extra cash when they have gaps on their recording schedule.
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But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go.
The project hasn't failed, the project was to earn a living going out playing DS songs, they have done that and it has been highly successful. They play some massive shows.
OK, contributing to a living then, I doubt it is a single source of income for any of them (but neither was DS). I have no info but I doubt there is much money in session fees these days when no one pays for music, live is where the money is.
I won't say to earn a living as far as most of them are session players currently working, quite a lot under Trevor Horn wings and different Italian producers and artists, I would say they do extra cash when they have gaps on their recording schedule.
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But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go.
The project hasn't failed, the project was to earn a living going out playing DS songs, they have done that and it has been highly successful. They play some massive shows.
I'm as always not saying enough information to convey my position lol. I mean fail not financially, they obviously earn some coins while at it. But fail in the eyes of fans like me. At this point, I would go to almost any DS tribute band's show in the world BUT DSL, simply because of their attitude. Even Mark's harshest and most insulting song to date hasn't made them any less full of themselves. And this "three-chord trick" answer to MK... Oh, come on, I just can't take them seriously.
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Yeah, I used to share that view but I guess I'm mellowing with age, if fans go and have a good time then I don't really care.
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Dire Straits would have gone on If Mark had wanted to.
Because Mark wanted something different with the 96er, they are not a Dire Strais bis.
Ther are something else.
But to say they can't rock, well listen them perform live TR in 1996 or Boom or Like That in 2005.
All of the original 96er have a career outside Mark. They are professionnal hired guns.
And they sounds the way Mark ask them.
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But all of a sudden, it turns out that it's not that easy to reproduce DS, and the project was almost bound to fail from the get-go.
The project hasn't failed, the project was to earn a living going out playing DS songs, they have done that and it has been highly successful. They play some massive shows.
OK, contributing to a living then, I doubt it is a single source of income for any of them (but neither was DS). I have no info but I doubt there is much money in session fees these days when no one pays for music, live is where the money is.
I won't say to earn a living as far as most of them are session players currently working, quite a lot under Trevor Horn wings and different Italian producers and artists, I would say they do extra cash when they have gaps on their recording schedule.
I guess that's the reason they do as much gigs as they can, as long as there is a demand to listen to DS music played by ex DS members.
Imagine if they would had a main singer and guitarist from the UK, like Terence Reiss from the first version of their band instead of an Italian singer.
By the way, I'm attending their Alicante gig this Saturday. Quite curious to see how they are live in person.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
I respect Richard as a guitarist and for his career but the 96ers have never been capable of reproducing a rock and roll sound like any DS incarnation. Perhaps the main reason we haven't heard Private Investigations or TOL from them is that they sound more pipe and slippers than rock and roll.
Mark's solo band was never intended to be a rock and roll band. That was one of the reasons he ended DS - he wanted to play the kind of songs he wanted to play and so he searched for the most accomplished musicians he could find who could do that. In my opinion he did an excellent job. This band can play just about anything that is required of them and is certainly not a pipe and slippers band!
Unless I'm mistaken he disbanded DS because "it got too big." To me that's really saying that the pressure to produce another commercially successful album and tour was too much. There's nothing really wrong with that (although people are paid far less money for far greater pressure) and his solo albums have indeed enabled him to keep the low-key profile he so craves. He's still making music but not having the fame he had with DS - best of both worlds.
He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
I respect Richard as a guitarist and for his career but the 96ers have never been capable of reproducing a rock and roll sound like any DS incarnation. Perhaps the main reason we haven't heard Private Investigations or TOL from them is that they sound more pipe and slippers than rock and roll.
Mark's solo band was never intended to be a rock and roll band. That was one of the reasons he ended DS - he wanted to play the kind of songs he wanted to play and so he searched for the most accomplished musicians he could find who could do that. In my opinion he did an excellent job. This band can play just about anything that is required of them and is certainly not a pipe and slippers band!
Unless I'm mistaken he disbanded DS because "it got too big." To me that's really saying that the pressure to produce another commercially successful album and tour was too much. There's nothing really wrong with that (although people are paid far less money for far greater pressure) and his solo albums have indeed enabled him to keep the low-key profile he so craves. He's still making music but not having the fame he had with DS - best of both worlds.
He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
Not one. Golden Heart and Sailing To Philadelphia are not just UK ;)
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The 96s are all successful in their own right. They all have their own careers outside of Mark's band!
I respect Richard as a guitarist and for his career but the 96ers have never been capable of reproducing a rock and roll sound like any DS incarnation. Perhaps the main reason we haven't heard Private Investigations or TOL from them is that they sound more pipe and slippers than rock and roll.
Mark's solo band was never intended to be a rock and roll band. That was one of the reasons he ended DS - he wanted to play the kind of songs he wanted to play and so he searched for the most accomplished musicians he could find who could do that. In my opinion he did an excellent job. This band can play just about anything that is required of them and is certainly not a pipe and slippers band!
Unless I'm mistaken he disbanded DS because "it got too big." To me that's really saying that the pressure to produce another commercially successful album and tour was too much. There's nothing really wrong with that (although people are paid far less money for far greater pressure) and his solo albums have indeed enabled him to keep the low-key profile he so craves. He's still making music but not having the fame he had with DS - best of both worlds.
He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
I did say ONE of the reasons! He doesn't churn out stuff either - 4 years is a long time! ;)
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He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
The 96ers are his core band and don't forget the folkies he added.
Mark would not use them for so long if they could not deliver what he is looking for.
Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
And with all respect, regarding session musician, I think you can't find better places than Nashville and LA when you need some top hired guns.
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He doesn't churn out stuff either - 4 years is a long time! ;)
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Ha ha! That was a little tongue in cheek. ;D
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He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
The 96ers are his core band and don't forget the folkies he added.
Mark would not use them for so long if they could not deliver what he is looking for.
Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
And with all respect, regarding session musician, I think you can't find better places than Nashville and LA when you need some top hired guns.
I know exactly what you mean and I will acknowledge some of the very best live and work in Nashville, however that doesn't mean it should be the basis for starting a band or that they will be the best for playing the type of music he is going to be playing live. It's like building a football team with 11 top class players but no thought of them being able to form a team or being able to play together.
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He hired Nashville musicians then recorded all but one of his albums in the UK. Crazy decision for me when there are so many great musicians here that could do what he wanted, would be ready at the drop of a hat for recording at BG (not just phoning it in) and that would likely suit his music better than a country Nashville type. I'm not saying they can't play what he wants but they are clearly more at home with the stuff he churns out nowadays.
The 96ers are his core band and don't forget the folkies he added.
Mark would not use them for so long if they could not deliver what he is looking for.
Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
And with all respect, regarding session musician, I think you can't find better places than Nashville and LA when you need some top hired guns.
I know exactly what you mean and I will acknowledge some of the very best live and work in Nashville, however that doesn't mean it should be the basis for starting a band or that they will be the best for playing the type of music he is going to be playing live. It's like building a football team with 11 top class players but no thought of them being able to form a team or being able to play together.
I think the single reason for the formation of the band Mark ended up playing with is they're all multi-instrumentalists. Everybody plays everything, so it's not a 20-piece orchestra. Richard plays a whole truckload of instruments, Glenn plays every bass imaginable, keyboard players can play the organs, accordions, guitars, synths, percussion and pianos, and so on. Mark went a little over the top with multi-instrumentalists in my opinion, but probably for a reason. His music is pretty diverse, too.
The only non-multi-instrumentalist in Mark's band is probably the drummer. Or, they should sing, too!
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The 96er are not a band of their own.
They are top musician playing for Mark
Are they are not into a competition, they are not to be the "best team" against another band.
They are to match Mark expectations.
I don't how they were recruited but GH sessions featured a lot more men and Mark even used an all british band at some point.
Mark could have changed most of his backing member over the years but did not so I guess Mark was happy with them.
My personnal view is another thing.
To me the best line up were 1996 and 2005.
Then it turned a bit too folky for my taste but it was Mark decision.
2019 featuring the horn section was interesting but halas this came too late to get the real potential.
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I think the only reason MK keeps calling the Nashville musicians is because they are friends...
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I think the only reason MK keeps calling the Nashville musicians is because they are friends...
And also because they do a great job?
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Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
I don't think Mark hads much to do with it. Someone pointed out to GF a while back that they had more or less copped the arrangement from some bluegrass band and the further development was surely led by John's little fiddle break.
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Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
I don't think Mark hads much to do with it. Someone pointed out to GF a while back that they had more or less copped the arrangement from some bluegrass band and the further development was surely led by John's little fiddle break.
I'm sure that John and Mike were involved with the development of Marbletown and MK used it to showcase their talent.
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Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
I don't think Mark hads much to do with it. Someone pointed out to GF a while back that they had more or less copped the arrangement from some bluegrass band and the further development was surely led by John's little fiddle break.
I'm sure that John and Mike were involved with the development of Marbletown and MK used it to showcase their talent.
A friend of mine sent me some years ago some songs in spotify from bluegrass musicians that were playing songs with parts that are too similar than the Marbletown instrumental parts...
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I think the only reason MK keeps calling the Nashville musicians is because they are friends...
Dire Straits started on friendship.
The 96er were born on craftmanship.
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The 96ers are his core band and don't forget the folkies he added.
Mark would not use them for so long if they could not deliver what he is looking for.
Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
What I mean is Marbletown performed by Dire Straits would never have developped that way.
The 96ers are a versatile band that give Mark something different on par with what he is expecting from them, especially for country folk.
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The 96ers are his core band and don't forget the folkies he added.
Mark would not use them for so long if they could not deliver what he is looking for.
Remember how Mark developped Marbletown live for example.
What I mean is Marbletown performed by Dire Straits would never have developped that way.
The 96ers are a versatile band that give Mark something different on par with what he is expecting from them, especially for country folk.
I like this thought. I agree.
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Why does everyone write 96ers? It was a loose name for the musicians in 1996. After that, no one used that name anymore. Unless I'm wrong :think
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Why does everyone write 96ears? It was a loose name for the musicians in 1996. After that, no one used that name anymore. Unless I'm wrong :think
Because it is a fun and practical name to apply to them ;D
The 96rs and 2 folkies
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Why does everyone write 96ears? It was a loose name for the musicians in 1996. After that, no one used that name anymore. Unless I'm wrong :think
Because it is a fun and practical name to apply to them ;D
The 96rs and 2 folkies
Ok:)
I checked. I was sure the name 96ers was in Golden Heart album booklet. But there isn't. Appears in Sailing To Philadelphia booklet.
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Why does everyone write 96ers? It was a loose name for the musicians in 1996. After that, no one used that name anymore. Unless I'm wrong :think
That's how MK used to call his band until the STP period, even there is a mention about that in the STP cd booklet when he calls Paul Franklin an honorary 96er, but he really never used the name officially and never used it again after that tour, but some of us still find the name useful.
If you think about it, is better than The Dullards :lol
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Honorary 96er calls Chuck Ainlay:)
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Why does everyone write 96ers? It was a loose name for the musicians in 1996. After that, no one used that name anymore. Unless I'm wrong :think
That's how MK used to call his band until the STP period, even there is a mention about that in the STP cd booklet when he calls Paul Franklin an honorary 96er, but he really never used the name officially and never used it again after that tour, but some of us still find the name useful.
If you think about it, is better than The Dullards :lol
Ed was right and literally proved my point! 😁
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Mark’s band can play those songs in any form the boss wants it to. Those guys are top shelf musicians in Nashville. If any tune doesn’t sound as rock’n roll as it did in the past that’s because Mark wants it. And let’s be honest, the current arrangements fit much better our favorite grandpa’s playing and singing