A Mark In Time
General Discussion => General Discussion => Topic started by: jacki on September 10, 2008, 10:36:26 AM
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This is the eve of the most horrific example of human hatred in my lifetime, if not of all time. We need to never forget it, lest complacency sets in. It has made a permanent mark on my life. At one and the same time, it has made me more willing to see the brightness in life and also to not be blind to the inhumanity of those for whom power is all. In one horrible hour, my life was changed; and I have always felt, since then, that though I don't believe I personally knew anyone who was a victim in the Towers or in any of the planes, I still consider that I lost over 2,000 family members that day. I had stayed up that entire night (a night off) and had overindulged at Taco Bell (couldn't eat any Taco Bell for 5 years afterwards); I had gone to bed only 45 minutes prior to being jolted awake by my next door neighbor's frantic voice on my answering machine yelling to turn on the TV; and the rest of that awful day...and days later...are a fog of disbelief and forlorn hope. I still have the list of things I had intended to do that day taped to my bathroom mirror, where I had put it the night before, and have no intention of taking it down. In some ways it is a memorial to all those others, who foresaw just another day, as I did. Please, in whatever way you consider spirituality, keep this day in mind. Here's to those who left us on September 11, 2001. Eternal peace and remembrance.
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i was in London, in a cab, hearing it live. then working, and people (employees at our regent street store) kept running into the office in panic as they had relatives in the air, direction usa, ..very scary time.
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I was in the office when I received a phonecall from a friend telling me to put on the TV. Which I did on internet. The whole office was sitting around my desk watching it and we didn't work that day.
The whole day I tried to call a friend who was in the US for business but I didn't know where he was. Only in the middle of the night (Europe-time) I had him on the phone, far away from all the troubles and horror.
I hope this will never happen again and we all have to remember that day, the losses and the meaningless of this action. Someday I hope the world will be a better place with respect and peace.
Let us all hope, pray or whatever your religion or vision to life allows you to do that people will remember this day and learned that violence doesn't solve any problem at all.
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I was actually thinking about this subject today.
I was in a plane when the first one went in & then got on another plane for the second leg of the journey after watching the second one go into the other tower on the tv in the terrminal.Needless to say everyone on the plane was on edge & we were in Irl & the UK so everything hadn't stopped like the US.
To make it worse we actually had a holiday booked to NY on the 17th Sept 01 & to make it doubly worse we went! I have to say that it wasn't the most pleasant flight that I was ever on,but everyone was saying that it was the safest time to fly? Yeah but they were'nt on the plane!
We passed by the ground zero area on the circle line cruise about 12 days later & there was still smoke coming out of the ruins - it was very creepy because you were now looking at something which was real as opposed to something dreamlike.
What a crazy,mindless,senceless thing for people to do >:(.The knock on effect is multiplied thousands & thousands of times over,spouses lost,kids lost,grandparents lost,uncles/aunts lost,friends lost - its endless!
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I was working in Aberdeen, my colleague had a radio but nobody else did, we were dependant on him for updates until we finished.
Couldn't believe it at the time.
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I had gotten up for the day and turned on the tv in time to see the live film of the second plane hitting the towers. At first I thought it was just some idiot who didn't know how to fly, but the then horrid horrid news was announced. I had to sit down. It was unspeakable.
But I also have to say that Hitler's persecution of all things not Hitler equaled the hatred we saw on 9/11. Unfortunately, the list is unspeakably long.
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I was in my office when someone called to tell us that a plane hit the World Trade Center. We put on the radio and someone brought in a TV. The entire office watched in horror as things unfolded. Work was suspended for the day but no one left. We chose to stay together. No one wanted to go home to an empty house or apt.
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Here is a bit of news that USA Media did not cover: 10 thousand Iranians marched in public, in sympathy and support for the US and World citizens whose lives were destroyed. I did not know that until I read the book, Reading Lolita in Tehran. Shame on the USA news for that. We can't have American citizens 'liking' Iranians, now can we. (I hope that the sarcasm is obvious.
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The only people I hold responsible are the animals like bin Laden (I knew immediately that he was the one to blame, even though at the moment I could not recall his name; I don't remember a lot of what I said over the phone in the minutes after turning on my TV, but I do remember saying, "It was that bastard with the beard") and the other hate mongers who twist the minds of the impressionable youth in that part of the world. I know almost every ethnic and religious group in the world was represented at the WTC; you have to wonder at the mindset that routinely sacrifice their own for their own gain. I have never, never understood a hate so all encompassing. You are right, Marie; Hitler was easily as bad, but this was such a gut punch. You'd like to believe that we have evolved a little further than that, but I guess we'll never be free of hate. I was literally in a haze for a few weeks after September 11. I forgot about meds, I forgot to eat, and I started to worry all the time, about everything. I also agree with you about the way the media/government twists things around and colors the minds of readers, or tries to. I have a friend who is half Iranian; she worried ceaselessly in the days after September 11 about her beautiful son and daughter, and if they would become targets for overzealous Americans looking to settle scores. Sorry about this long post; I find I can get through this anniversary better if I talk it out.
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I know where I was and what I saw. Terrible and so sad. Lots of other feelings and emotions aroused too, many of them that cause me confusion and angst to this day.
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I was waiting for my neighbor and walking partner. I had turned the radio on (as I often did before I left for my walk-to make any burglars think someone was home-not that we really have many burglars in my neighborhood -one can't be too careful). Anyway, it was about 8:45 AM. The first thing I heard was that a plane had hit one of the towers. They were surmising that it was a private pilot who had lost his bearings. I ran into the den and turned on the TV-to the "Today Show", with Katie Couric and Matt Lauer. They were discussing the mysterious and horrible "accident" when the second plane hit the other tower. At that point, everyone knew it wasn't an accident. My neighbor arrived and I ushered her in to watch TV with me. She didn't know what had happened. We stayed glued to the unfolding events.
My husband was on a flight to Chicago, with his business partner, at the very moments when this all transpired. Rumors were flying within the media, that a plane was on the way to hit the Sears Tower in Chicago. I was frantic. I also had the added terror that my oldest son was living in Brooklyn and could have conceivably have been on lower Manhattan, near the World Trade Center. Anyone who lived in NYC could have been near the WTC-for one reason or another. I unsuccessfully tried to contact Gerry. I couldn't get through to my son. I was a mess.
Gerry finally called me from O'Hare airport, in Chicago. The flight attendant had announced the tragedy in New York, just as they landed. She informed everyone that every plane in the country was grounded and that passengers would have to make other arrangements to get where they needed to go. Everyone was in shock. Gerry said that when they entered the terminal, every eye was on the TV monitors and you could hear a pin drop-it was that quiet. Many were on their cell phones, trying to figure out what to do. There wasn't a car to rent or a train in service. Many were stuck at the airport-with nowhere to go and no way to get there. Fortunately, Chicago is about 5 hours from us. An employee of Gerry's drove to Chicago to pick them up and drive them back.
I finally got in touch with my son-after the towers collapsed. He had been asleep, due to a late night of work the previous evening. He had no idea what had happened. I told him. He said he could smell smoke, hear the sirens and that there were bits of paper and ash floating through the air. He was stunned. We spoke for a bit and then he said he needed to make a few phone calls, in order to find out if all of his friends were ok. I spoke to him several times, throughout the day, when I could make the connection. So many people were calling to and from New York-the lines were jammed.
My younger son was at work-locally-and came home to be with me. We watched the news and shared our disbelief and horror. Gerry wouldn't be getting home until about 10:30 that evening and I hated to be alone. When he did arrive, we hugged each other for a very long time.
In the days after 9/11 we spoke often with our older son. He described the scene in New York.....
Immediately after I had spoken with him, on that morning of 9/11, he went down to the Brooklyn Promenade, which is a park on the river-close to the Brooklyn Bridge (which many of the people in Lower Manhattan walked across, to get to safety). It's also directly in view of the former WTC. Justin said there were columns of smoke rising from where the towers used to be. Most of the people crossing the bridge were covered in ash, wearing business attire and looking dazed. It was all very somber.
He said that in the days following the attack, New York was uncharacteristically quiet-no honking horns, no radios blaring from windows, nobody yelling. He walked into a bar and it was full of people, yet eerily silent-except for the television on which everyone was watching the news about the attacks. Lower Manhattan was closed to the public, except for residents. New York City was in a state of shock.
One month later, Gerry, our son AJ and I drove to NYC to see Justin. As we approached the Lincoln Tunnel, into the city, an alert was broadcast over the radio for everyone to be on the lookout for unmarked white vans-occupied by terrorists. There were what seemed like a bazillion unmarked white vans approaching the tunnel, along with every other kind of vehicle! WELCOME TO NEW YORK, POST 9/11! Everyone looked like a potential terrorist! We were that paranoid....
All over New York, there were signs, letters and posters-thanking the police and fire departments for their wonderful response to the tragedy. There were first responders from all over the country walking the streets of New York. People were stopping them, thanking them and taking their pictures. New Yorkers were friendly, helpful and concerned-very unusual for a city of that size, temperment and reputation. Our previous visits to the city had never been like that. It was amazing.
There was also an anthrax scare at NBC News while we were there. The media was swarming all over the NBC building.
On October 12th, 2001, we walked down to Lower Manhattan, to pay homage to the victims of 9/11. As we approached the Financial District and Wall Street, I was struck by the height and closeness of the buildings. I thought "OMG, it must have been so horrible for those who were near the WTC! The buildings there are (were) so much taller and there were so many panic-stricken people running for their lives!" A shiver went through me....
Closer to the disaster site, there were thousands of notes and letters posted from people looking for loved ones. There were a few hundred people walking about-mostly in reverent silence. We got closer to the site and noticed the soot covering the buildings, windows and even inside the closed businesses. There were many volunteers, firefighters, police, emergency personnel, military and city workers beyond the area which was cordoned off from the public. About 3-4 city blocks from where we stood, you could see the smoke still rising from what used to be the WTC-and this was one month later! The buildings immediately surrounding the WTC were a twisted mass of metal and concrete. I could see the huge American flag which workers had placed at the ruins. It was all terribly sad and brought tears to my eyes. Many people were crying. I have never felt so helpless and hopeless-yet proud of my country and what these wonderful people were doing, who had come from all over the world, to look for remains and clean up the horrible mess that had been made by the terrorists.
Tomorrow I will remember, as I do every year on September 11. I will remember where I was, how I felt and what I was doing. Nothing will ever be the same. We became too complacent in this country, thinking that we were safe from what so many other countries have had to deal with. We were naive. There is no protection from suicidal extremists who will stop at nothing to promote their cause...
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One of those days you never forget. :'( I was at work and someone's wife called to say that a plane hit the WTC. Someone else found a radio and we started listening to the news bulletins--soon after the second plane hit. We got updates from phone calls and the radio--not much info on the internet. Someone was working in North Jersey and called the office to say they could see the towers burning--it was madness. We thought work might be cancelled but we had to work all day, I didn't see the horrible videos until I got home that night. :'( The grief, sadness and anger were overwhelming--not just for the victims of the maniacs but for the war(s) I knew would eventually come. All the more troubling was realizing that this was intended to start war yet I couldn't see a way that wouldn't come to pass (and it did). As news details unraveled over the next days and weeks I imagined over and over what it must have been like for the poor souls in the towers and on the planes. I think we all imagined what it must have been like, as difficult as it was to think about.
I really try not to hate but I hate the bastards who planned and executed this. >:( There is evil in the world, even if many choose not to accept that as reality. It was a wake up call, not just for America but for the world, but it didn't last long and most of us soon went back to sleep. So many people don't want to think about this, some lunatics even deny that Muslim extremists carried this out (guess they forgot the video of Bin Laden gloating about how successful it was).
I think there was a cover up, but not the kind you think. This attack was meant to be much larger, but most of the planes were stopped. I think it was meant to take the US out, not to wound us. Soon after September 11 there was a news report that at least 10 planes were involved. That story disappeared quick, don't know why but probably to keep people calm.
I remember all the news reports and sympathy from around the world. That all seems to be forgotten now. But this battle for the survival of civilized society will go on for decades (or longer). Even if you don't realize it....
God Bless America!
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I visited the area of Ground Zero a couple of years after the tragedy. Everything had been cleaned up and looked eerily sterile and empty, yet you could feel the buildings there, standing in spectral memory. My ex roommate and I spent a couple of hours roaming the plaza in front of the pit, and without exception everyone there was pensive, quiet, and seemed on the verge of tears. We went from there to the church across the street...if I remember correctly, it is the oldest church in America still to be operating as a church, continually, since it was built. It is directly across from where the Towers were, and had to have been completely in the shadow of those huge buildings. On that morning, the church and the cemetery in front of it were covered with debris, yet the church was untouched. It became the place where the responders, and later the volunteers, gathered to rest, to get something to eat, and to reflect. It is still in use as a church...there was a service going on when we were there...but its mission now is deeper, as it has become a museum dedicated to the people involved in the horrors of that day and the days afterward. There are boxes of Kleenex everywhere inside the church, and I am not too shy to admit I made use of them as I went around looking at the exhibits. Of everything I saw during my visit to New York that weekend, that church meant the most to me of it all.
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Maybe 4th time lucky. I have tried to respond to this post 3 times earlier today, and each time I have been returned to this posting reply screen, and my reply failed to appear on the boards.
I had just gone to bed about 11:30pm from memory. My son was watching something on T.V. and it had been interupted to bring live CNN coverage of a plane crash into the North tower of the World Trade Centre. As I sat down in the lounge to watch it with my son the 2nd. plane hit. I knew straight away now that the first one wasn't an accident, but the work of a group of fanatical wankers with nothing but Evil on their adgenda. It has had a profound impact on my sense of well-being and trust, and it is something that we should never allow to happen again. I believe our man also had a huge change of attitude which comes across in his songs since that time, none more so than this one... which we all know was about that day:-
"My famous last words
Are laying around in tatters
Sounding absurd
Whatever I try
But I love you
And that
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I just can't believe it was 7 years ago!!! :o Where has the time gone? I still remember it so vividly. I was at school when it actually happened but my mum picked me up and the first thing she said was 'have you heard what has happened in America?' Obviously I hadn't a clue. At the time she just said that a plane had flown into the WTC, and at this stage everyone was under the impression it was some horrible accident. By the time we got home the second plane had already hit. I was only 16 (still relatively young I think) and I remember being quite concerned what it meant for the world, how would life change? Very scary times indeed. I spent the rest of the afternoon just fixed to the television. And no matter how many times they showed the video each viewing was as horrific as the last. Something very difficult to understand.
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For those here who do not know, I am a Police Detective in Baltimore, Maryland
So... is The Wire realistic?
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Good to see you here BPD :D
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Welcome on board :)
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Nice to see you here BPD! :)
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Cool stuff! I've only watched the first season, but I'll need to look out for you when I make it there. What are you doing in the ep? And did you get to meet Steve Earle? :)
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Here's a link to the photos I took in NYC, October 2001...
http://picasaweb.google.com/gbobmi/WTCWeWillNeverForget#
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Hi BPD. Long time no see.
It was my day off 09/11/01, and i just happened to turn on the TV just as the 1st plane had gone in. I watched as it all unfolded, and at that early stage they were saying it looked just like an accident. Then you see pics of another plane coming in, and i thought it was a re-run of the 1st plane. How wrong i was. :(
The rest of the images will haunt me forever.
I've been watching lots of programs about it on the TV this week, and one thing still bothers me about that day, and that is the very few pics of the events that happened at the Pentagon.
I don't want to start a debate here, but it sure doesn't look like a plane that goes into the building.?????????
Cheers BBB
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Thanks for the pictures Gayle, very impressive. But so sad :'(
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It WAS a plane, BBB...pretty sure there is no doubt on that score. Yes, it does seem a bit lopsided...I suppose because the attacks on the WTC and the valiant efforts by the other plane's passengers in Shanksville, PA seem so much more dramatic...From the point of view of the Pentagon staff, I'm sure their tribulations were every bit as awful. Nothing should undercut the fact that all the events of that day weigh the same. May they not have all died in vain. I pray that nothing like that ever happens again.
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Alright, I'll come out and say it. I was in school too- it was my first year in high school. Hard to believe...time flies. The administration made an announcement over the loud speaker, and our class watched the news via TV with the video that played over and over of the second plane crashing into the WTC tower. Everyone went home shortly after, shocked. I grew up and went to school in the suburbs of New York City, and some of the people in my class had family or knew people that worked in or around the WTC. The father of one of my friends was a NYC fireman and died inside WTC 1. At that time my own father worked in a building around the corner from the WTC and witnessed the second plane crash into the second tower from his office. It took him the rest of the day to get home- a commute that usually lasts one hour. Personally, I watched the rest of the nightmare unfold that day on TV. An all around tragic day.
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I do hope that i havn't offended anyone, it's just that every programme on the TV at the moment that deals with the events of 9/11 seem to mention conspiracy theorys.
Of course every terrible event that happened that day weighs the same. It was one of the worst days in history this world will ever see, and i too pray that nothing like this ever happens again.
BBB
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Hi BPD. Long time no see... I don't want to start a debate here, but it sure doesn't look like a plane that goes into the building.?????????
Cheers BBB
I have seen articles written regarding the idea that it may have been a missile that hit the Pentagon. Apparently (according to the articles) two missiles were fired at the plane which was credited with striking the Pentagon. One missile took that plan down, the second missed and hit the Pentagon. Now, I am not saying if I believe these reports or not, but I will say that as far as conspiracies theories go, this is a good one. I, for one, hope that IF it is true, that it never fully comes to light. People in this country simply could not handle the thought of the government shooting down a commercial airliner. I am not much for conspiracy theories. That said, I do believe that Oswald did NOT act alone.
BBB, in case you missed my first post, please check out my website for a glimpse into how I reacted on 9/11/01:
www.investigationcontinuing.com (http://www.investigationcontinuing.com)
Peace.
Yes BP I can imagine that it is still very raw for many of your countrymen, and the thought of the plane being brought down by a missile would be even harder to take.
Although if I were a person on that plane knowing that we were going to crash into something (and I think from memory people with cell phones knew?) I would probably prefer the surprise element of being taken by surprise - not that you'd be in any state to know the difference I suppose..... absolute terror.....
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I was in bed when the first plane hit, but my husband was watching TV from the beginning. I came downstairs, and he told me what had happened, and I saw the second plane hit. I initially was thinking tens of thousands of people must have died. I was glad I was wrong, but what a horrific loss of innocent life.
My husband's son had worked in an office across the street from the WTC but had been fired a few weeks earlier, which likely saved his life as his old office was destroyed.
I actually had met one of the people on the United plane. I wouldn't say I knew him, but I talked to him for work a number of times. In fact, because of that man's actions one night, the next day I met a man who later became my best friend.
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Willie Nelson believes that there was a conspiracy.
http://www.kvue.com/news/local/stories/020408kvuenelson-bkm.8e5c8740.html
Who to believe, Willie Nelson or George Bush, hmm...
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Not hard at all. We've never known Willie to lie. . . all he's done is neglected to pay some income taxes. Georgie changed the writing on the barn wall to start a wall. (You have to have read Animal Farm to get that.)
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I hesitate to post this, but want to put down where I come from on all of this. Please no-one be offended because that is the last thing I would ever want to do.
9/11 was a tragedy for the free world, esp the US, and most importantly for all those who lost loved ones in this gross act of terrorism. I understand why the anniversary of 9/11 is so important to so many. For me, there are too many painful anniversaries/tragedies to remember so I don't have a special thing for 9/11. I remember many tragedies frequently throughout the year:
Iraq
Afghanistan
London
Madrid
Bosnia
Rwanda
Northern Ireland
Middle East
Cambodia
Vietnam
Korea
WW2
The holocaust
etc, etc
Innocents are dying every day, and that's v important to remember. So I would say, and perhaps you do this - when you remember whichever anniversary/tragedy is closest to your heart, remember the many others too.
Try to understand what drives terrorists to kill and maim and think of ways to prevent them doing it. Vote for politicians who can espouse their thoughts on this in ways that seem fair and right to your heart and avoid like the plague those who have the powers to make matters worse.
I think the same way about personal tragedy too. When I think about my mum, who died last year, I try to always think of other people who are in the bereavement process. I say a little something for them, and I am helped because I am reminded I'm not alone in how I might be feeling.
Guys, TY for letting me put this down. It's how I deal with bad things. No offence to those who do things differently. God bless the innocents who die every day..
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Nicely put draad. While the tragic events of 9/11 are of course remembered here in the UK (you only have to look at the whole host of shows that were on TV here last week about it), I don't think there's any question that the hurt will have been more deeply felt in the US.
I must admit that while I was shocked and saddened by the events at the time, and took part in the 3 minutes of silence for those who died, I don't have any special way of remembering the events each year, other than reflecting on them and the aftermath often.
As for your list, they are all too terrible for words - and don't forget Darfur. :(
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lAjhRHlYEak
(PS I see Northern Ireland on the list and it would be interesting to have a discussion on the different perceptions on both sides of the Atlantic of what went on in Northern Ireland, but I think that's for another time.)
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For several years I devoted an effort to planting a tulip for everyone who died on 9/11. I was up to about 400 when, in 2004, my various physical problems began to make it extremely difficult to spend any time on my hands and knees. And then the tulips...which apparently deteriorate over time, unless you are lucky enough to get the long lived variety, which are not plentiful....began to get spotty in number. Next Spring, I hope to start over again. This fall is too soon as I am currently still recuperating from my last surgery, but hopefully my limitations have been temporarily crimped. I may switch to daffodils as well, as they are a constant and faithful, and beautiful, flower, and worthy of gracing the memories of those people. And draad, I do agree with you. We could spend every waking moment of the day remembering those who have gone before, and I do sometimes find myself remembering my lost ones...by a chance remark from someone, a tone of voice, a sound, a shared vision....thank you for emphasizing that remembrance is one of the most important elements of life.
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Hi jcser. Remembrance is v important and part of how things go forward. This thread is too raw for me. Let's talk bout something else please.
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Great idea Jacki. I don't know anything about flowers, but I know we are exporting tulips a lot. If I can give any help by sending you something from Holland it's all my pleasure (you have to say which kind, because I really don't know a thing about it)
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As an American who lives in New Jersey, not all that far from where the twin towers fell, of course 9-11 has impacted my life to a much greater extent than Europe and the rest of the world, not to mention much of the USA. I don't like lumping all these wars together (even if Iraq and Afghanistan sprang from 9-11). It decreases the impact and immediacy of what happened.
We didn't get the in your face news coverage--as it happened--with any of the other events. It also wasn't exclusively an attack on innocent civilians, an utterly cowardly and contemptible attack by deranged maniacs--and there are millions more of these maniacs waiting for their turn to do something similar or even more destructive, not just to the USA but throughout the civilized world. I don't think that draad is trying to equivocate about 9-11, but that's how it feels to me.
There's certainly nothing wrong with remembering and grieving about any of the tragic events, wars, or natural disasters that affect you, your friends, relatives, loved ones, etc.
BUT--they are not all the same, which is the basic point I take from this discussion.
Just pray that the next 9-11 doesn't affect your country directly, although the way things are going with the appeasement of those who want to destroy the free world it just might affect us all.
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Draad, your post was powerful and thoughtful. You helped remind us that observances of memorable days (both great and horrible ones) are about others and what they have endured. Compassion is a global thing, and every horror that we in the US went through on 9/11 has been repeated far too many times in other parts of the world, from Darfur to Pakistan just this weekend. Your post showed a true spirit of humanity. Thank you.
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i like the way this thread is being handled by the various contributors, decent, serene, but powerful.
i will not comment on it, as my comment would be a mix of many things said here.
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I just start working near Barcelona the day before, and as 11th September is bank holyday in Catalonia, I didn