A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: twm on April 07, 2012, 10:09:22 AM
-
This may be a bit late but there is a clip of DS on "The Tube" ( long ago British TV pop and rock programme) today:
http://skyarts.sky.com/listings
Again, most of you will have seen this already but I thought I'd mention it anyway.
FOOTNOTE # 1 If you check this link after Saturday 7 April 2012, it will show the programme listings for that day. There may be re-runs, of course.
FOOTNOTE # 2 Just out of interest, "The Tube" was broadcast from Newcastle upon Tyne, which, in itself, must have been intriguing to the Knopfler brothers.
-
OK! OK! Having now seen this clip (Money For Nothing), it post-dates David K's departure and was not even shot in Tyne-Tees TV studios in Newcastle but some huge arena show. But at least I've seen the clip now. It looked like the era when MK and BD were on stage together in Australia. And MK had a similar appearance to that photo with JJ Cale, in another thread.
-
It was most likely the MFN clip from Wembley '85, which was shown on The Tube. Did MK have a blue vest on? ;)
-
Yes, I think so. Kind dull colour. Headband and stripey guitar.
-
It's one of my favourite MFNs - I just looked at it again. Wonderful concert altogether! :) I think MK was playing that custom-made LP with the blemish! ;)
-
Best DS concert ever.
LE
-
Best DS concert ever.
LE
you know I need to disagree here, right?
One word.... Uniondale....
-
Best DS concert ever.
LE
you know I need to disagree here, right?
One word.... Uniondale....
Was it broadcasted by tv or radio?
So Uniondale looses ;D
-
Best DS concert ever (for me). ;D
LE
-
Best DS concert ever.
LE
you know I need to disagree here, right?
One word.... Uniondale....
The best DS concert was the Uniondale show on the US leg? I'll have to listen to it again, but based on listening to the tapes I really felt that by October of '85, the band seemed to be getting a bit tired and bored with the long tour. The 1985-07-10 show has some kind of power and energy that is unrivaled by any of the shows that circulate. The versions of SoS and Tunnel of Love are definitely the best. For the US leg later that year, I think the Houston 8/17 show is actually the best.
-
Lemme know when you finished checking Dan :lol
-
That recently circulated show from LA 11.09.85 is a great show too. It contains one of the longest final solos on TOL that lasts an incredible 5:50s!
I like the shows from September, but sometimes I take a liking for the earlier ones and sometimes the later ones! Just whatever takes my fancy. I fancy that TOL from LA right now though! :P
-
Thought that was sept. 13th? One day before the jj's Cale thing :lol
-
Thought that was sept. 13th? One day before the jj's Cale thing :lol
San Fran that night.
-
Best DS concert ever (for me). ;D
LE
I think that what we find the "best" concert is almost always the first we heard, and we grow up with
the 2 first non official versions of Sultans I've heard were Chorus 78 and Mandela, and for many years I just couldn't find any other verions better than these 2 ones.
Of course, now , I've heard many others, and I like many other version, but these 2 ones will alaways have a special place in my heart.
To me Wembley 85 has nothing special, and I agree with Pottel, I far prefer the concerts from autumn 85.
But I think it just due to fortuity. If the first concert I ever heard had been Wembley, maybe I'd think the same as you LE :)
-
[quote author=Jean-Fran
-
TOL from the Final Oz sounds raw and full of energy. And no other SFA beats that one. But for BIA, Wembley wins by far...
-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ObzXL0p7t1E
Saw this back in 1989 for the first time and from 2:52 on I was sold forever.
;)
LE
-
Oh man, SFA from the Wembley show brings back so many memories. But it's funny though - I have never really been fashion-conscious, but that I actually thought they were cool back in my teens is actually pretty amazing. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the music, but they could have paid a tad more attention to looks. I mean, with the exception of Jack "Miami Vice Suit" Sonni and Terry "Pub Owner" Williams, they all look like computer geeks ("Ladies and gentlemen, would you please welcome, right out of the server room, Dire Straits!").
-
At least they were loved for their music not for their look. And Mark had a look.
-
Oh man, SFA from the Wembley show brings back so many memories. But it's funny though - I have never really been fashion-conscious, but that I actually thought they were cool back in my teens is actually pretty amazing. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the music, but they could have paid a tad more attention to looks. I mean, with the exception of Jack "Miami Vice Suit" Sonni and Terry "Pub Owner" Williams, they all look like computer geeks ("Ladies and gentlemen, would you please welcome, right out of the server room, Dire Straits!").
Hey now...be careful with how you talk about the computer geeks. :P
-
Hey now...be careful with how you talk about the computer geeks. :P
Huh?
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-b0uNS1NJMtE/TwzEHx7h3MI/AAAAAAAAARE/rhzcN5_W7uo/s1600/vintage-computer-geek.jpg)
;D
-
Ha!
Mark was wearing Chucks I remember, so that's VERY stylish, isn't it?
LE
-
What are Chucks? Hair extensions?
-
by the way, happened to stumble on SOS from Sydney 86 this morning and noticed that mark plays this white fender? did he play it on that all tour?
http://youtu.be/E2PCBx6s9SY
-
Hey now...be careful with how you talk about the computer geeks. :P
Huh?
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-b0uNS1NJMtE/TwzEHx7h3MI/AAAAAAAAARE/rhzcN5_W7uo/s1600/vintage-computer-geek.jpg)
;D
that is an historical pic..... :lol
-
by the way, happened to stumble on SOS from Sydney 86 this morning and noticed that mark plays this white fender? did he play it on that all tour?
http://youtu.be/E2PCBx6s9SY
(It's actually not a Fender)
No, on the Wembley arena show and Live Aid he played the red Schecter.
-
kay, but just on thos two london shows? or all tour, and did he just swap for the oz shows?
-
(http://sportswear.name/wp-content/uploads/Converse-Chuck-Taylor-High.jpg)
Chucks!
LE
-
Oh man, that pic of a computer guy is hilarious!! ;D
Guy looked cool too imho, but MK's trousers look like builders' overalls.
Btw, for me Alchemy is definitely much much better than any 85 show (in fact it's the best pieces of music for me ever). 85 shows lack the special energy combined with "innovativeness". It is best heard in the after summer bootlegs where the band is starting to get worn out a bit and bored. Eg TOL can have 19-22 minutes, but the part they added doesn't have any special solo, and imho is needless.
-
kay, but just on thos two london shows? or all tour, and did he just swap for the oz shows?
On the video from Toronto July 85 he's using it, yet earlier in the month at Wembley he isn't so he probably swapped when they crossed the Atlantic for the North American leg.
-
Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?
-
Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?
I often thought he had ordered it, then picked it up at Rudy's on the way to the first gig, then used it for the rest of the tour.
-
In most cases I'd prefer an 'early' gig of a tour. When you're watching/listening The Final Oz you see a band which is tired. Same for the OES-tour. The early ones from 1991 are far better than the ones from september 1992. Seemed that MK&Co were completely bored during the last part of the OES-tour. It became more a 'music-factory'. It lacked the freshness of the first part of the tour.
Right, but on the over hand, 'late' gigs of a tour are musically more evolved.
e.g. Portobello belle during LOG tour was far better in June 83 than in december 82 at Wembley
So it's hard to choose between a "fresh but not completely "resulted" gig" and a "more musically developped but (sometimes)"routine" gig" :-\
-
Maybe he got it in the US during the BIA tour?
I often thought he had ordered it, then picked it up at Rudy's on the way to the first gig, then used it for the rest of the tour.
yes, it seems the most likely to me
-
[quote author=Jean-Fran
-
Well Alchemy was one of the last concerts and OTN was May when the tour finished October, so no conclusions here!
It is interesting to note, however that they never committed to any live radio soundboards until the Woburn Abbey gig on 20.06.92 when the tour started on 23.08.91...
-
Oh man, that pic of a computer guy is hilarious!! ;D
Guy looked cool too imho, but MK's trousers look like builders' overalls.
Btw, for me Alchemy is definitely much much better than any 85 show (in fact it's the best pieces of music for me ever). 85 shows lack the special energy combined with "innovativeness". It is best heard in the after summer bootlegs where the band is starting to get worn out a bit and bored. Eg TOL can have 19-22 minutes, but the part they added doesn't have any special solo, and imho is needless.
The break is nice thought (it is abbridged in the Wembley 85 video, no band intro but the special piano licks with the images of the wheel and the fair are very nice IHMO, something Alchemy is missing); the solo is actually 30 seconds longer than Alchemy, a bit more sophisticated; the guitar is a bit softened (overdriven), and the backing vocals add a bit to it (albeith a bit cheesy).
All in all I rate TOL 19/20 in Wembley 85 and 18/20 in Alchemy. Both are excellent, I guess it is a matter of taste. I would love to have Wembley'85 on Bluray thought, too bad only Alchemy received this VIP treatment.
-
the solo is actually 30 seconds longer than Alchemy, a bit more sophisticated; the guitar is a bit softened (overdriven), and the backing vocals add a bit to it (albeith a bit cheesy).
All in all I rate TOL 19/20 in Wembley 85 and 18/20 in Alchemy. Both are excellent, I guess it is a matter of taste. I would love to have Wembley'85 on Bluray thought, too bad only Alchemy received this VIP treatment.
All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy :) Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 :)
-
All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy :) Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 :)
Well... actually some people say Sydney'86 is the best, and I totally disagree; I find it much less attractive than Wembley'85. The guitar tone is strange, and Mark does so many variations in the end solo that you really wonder what he is aiming at; I prefer Alchemy, more straightforward. And the intro in Alchemy is longer, with that nice saxophone by Mel Collins, instead of starting abruptly with the (overdriven to death) drums in Wembley; but one thing I think Wembley wins over Alchemy is the touching ambiant track (probably gu's synth) which is nicely blending with Alan's piano, just before Mark talks about the spanish city and stuff; no such ambiant track in Alchemy (Guy was not there !), which sounds a bit dry and less emotional in comparison. What do you think ?
-
To be honest I would rather listen to ToL from the MM tour than Alchemy, but much prefer the BIA tour versions. Reasons? Well, I love how the song bursts into life with the drums and sax followed by Marks nice powerful solo. I also like how he introduces the band, playing different parts of other tunes. Great stuff! But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale. The BIA tour versions are best at this without any doubt; the final solos are longer and build up more slowly. There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry. I think arpeggio is the proper name for the twiddly bits on Sultans but that's about it!
Why MM tour over Alchemy? Well, BIA versions are just perfect for me but if I want a stripped down version then MM tour versions will do very nicely. Alchemy is neither one thing or the other; not quite right and massively overrated.
-
Alchemy is neither one thing or the other; not quite right and massively overrated.
I understand your point of view, I also prefer Wembley over Alchemy, but objectively, they are both excellent stuff; "massively overrated" sounds massively harsh to me ;) Cheers
-
All the things you mentioned are excatly the reason for me that I don't consider it to be as perfect as aLchemy :) Yeah a matter of taste. For me the score would be aLchemy 25/20, any other show maximum 19/20 :)
Well... actually some people say Sydney'86 is the best
I like the 85 version very much. The 86 shortend has something special that the 85 hasn't.
-
But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale. There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry. .
Crescendo? :)
-
But what I like most is how the song slows down and then Mark so brilliantly builds it up again into a rousing finale. There is no doubt a musical name for this but I'm not musically informed - sorry. .
Crescendo? :)
Isn't that just building the music up to a rousing finale, like Speedway? I meant a word meaning slowing it down, then building it up again.
-
Well... actually some people say Sydney'86 is the best, and I totally disagree; I find it much less attractive than Wembley'85. The guitar tone is strange, and Mark does so many variations in the end solo that you really wonder what he is aiming at; I prefer Alchemy, more straightforward. And the intro in Alchemy is longer, with that nice saxophone by Mel Collins, instead of starting abruptly with the (overdriven to death) drums in Wembley; but one thing I think Wembley wins over Alchemy is the touching ambiant track (probably gu's synth) which is nicely blending with Alan's piano, just before Mark talks about the spanish city and stuff; no such ambiant track in Alchemy (Guy was not there !), which sounds a bit dry and less emotional in comparison. What do you think ?
Have to listen to Sydney, heard it a long time ago.
I like the "abrupt" start of the intro, they used to do it also in earlier 1983 shows. But here the damned electronic drums are not very good (frankly put terrible imho :) ). It looks to me that it was one of those mainstream 80ties things that also Terry started using. The Solid Rock intro is similarly ruined. (But still Terry is da man.) It reminds me of Alan White from Yes, who had the same overdriven sound in 1984 and later.
Yeah, the synth is very good. The reason it's not on aLchemy is that Tommy Mandel was probably jumping his ass off even during that part of the song :)
-
Why MM tour over Alchemy? Well, BIA versions are just perfect for me but if I want a stripped down version then MM tour versions will do very nicely. Alchemy is neither one thing or the other; not quite right and massively overrated.
Say whaaaaat?? You're right dmg, is neither one thing or the other, aLCHEMY is THE thing! ;D
-
Oh deary me, I thought I might put a few noses out of joint with that. :-X
I still don't find myself listening to '82-'83 versions very often though. '85 versions rule! 8)
You want a simpler, shorter version, then why not go all out and grab a version from '80-'81?
-
Oh deary me, I thought I might put a few noses out of joint with that. :-X
I still don't find myself listening to '82-'83 versions very often though. '85 versions rule! 8)
You want a simpler, shorter version, then why not go all out and grab a version from '80-'81?
Actually, I don't like the 80-81 versions very much; reason being, they don't add much to the (actually very good) studio version (the same almost note by note), while having a weak guitar sound, weaker than the studio... For me, a live version has to reinvent the song to be interesting compared to the studio version; if live is just "less-than-perfect studio plus audience noise", what's the point ? I like very much the bonus track from Old Grey Whistle test on the Alchemy album, but, more out of historical curiosity, to see Mark play the Hammond organ, rather than for a true musical orgams; I find the alchemy version to be significantly better in that respect; and although I think, as I said, that Wembley 85 is slightly better than Alchemy, I do like the stronger (less overdriven, "purer"') guitar sound of 82-83 rather than the one of 85; again matter of taste, I can fully understand that you feel that 85 versions are better than 83 ones, but dismissing Alchemy as "massively overated" is not fair IMHO :)
-
But here the damned electronic drums are not very good (frankly put terrible imho :) ). It looks to me that it was one of those mainstream 80ties things that also Terry started using. The Solid Rock intro is similarly ruined. (But still Terry is da man.) It reminds me of Alan White from Yes, who had the same overdriven sound in 1984 and later.
Yeah, the synth is very good. The reason it's not on aLchemy is that Tommy Mandel was probably jumping his ass off even during that part of the song :)
Yeah, the overdriven drums are a shame, a mandatory gimmick for the mid-80s, that at least Alchemy does not suffer from. Alchemy aged better than Wembley in this respect, maybe this is why Mark ok'ed it rather than Wembley, fits better with his "purer" current sound.
As for Tommy Mandel, you might be quite right ;) I personnally think that Guy Fletcher designed a whole new sound when he joined DS, for the best (ambiant tracks) and the worse (overuse of keyboards on sultans, for instance). Guy's influence was reduced considerably for the subsequent OES tour (much less synth, but... more pedal steel, not my cup of tea).
-
Don't forget that the Wembley recording is not owned nor it has been recorded by Mercury. Alchemy was a record company product(ion) thus the reason it was choosen to be released as a DVD and BD.
It could have been done as a full concert release but it was made with little input from Mark on that point.
-
Don't forget that the Wembley recording is not owned nor it has been recorded by Mercury. Alchemy was a record company product(ion) thus the reason it was choosen to be released as a DVD and BD.
It could have been done as a full concert release but it was made with little input from Mark on that point.
Sure, but the Wembley recording is own by BBC, and it seems that the relationships between the BBC and Mark's management are quite good: the bonus tracks (Arena documentary, Old Grey Whiste test) on the Alchemy DVD are BBC programs, as well as the "Live at the BBC album"; certainly a deal could be done, should Mark have the will to release it... any hope ?
-
Sure, but the Wembley recording is own by BBC, and it seems that the relationships between the BBC and Mark's management are quite good: the bonus tracks (Arena documentary, Old Grey Whiste test) on the Alchemy DVD are BBC programs, as well as the "Live at the BBC album"; certainly a deal could be done, should Mark have the will to release it... any hope ?
[/quote]
It sure would be great to have the full concert. It's never been available before, even in audio.
-
Should we start an e-mail campaign to the BBC?
:-)
-
Wembley 85 is owned by Channel 4 not the BBC
-
Wembley 85 is owned by Channel 4 not the BBC
Whatever it is, the BBC4 documentary "MK - a life in songs" is showing some excerpts of Wembley 85, so they get have access to it... And release it on blu ray ! Maybe even with the missing tracks like RATR, of they find the Original tapes before mixing, unlike what they did for alchemy...
-
So I guess it has to be an initiative from the channel (Channel 4 in this case) to release it, or to re-broadcast it in his integrity... Isnt it?
Any idea to start a campaign to promove it?
-
Look what I
-
I hope this street view comes out:
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&cp=13&gs_id=1j&xhr=t&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&wrapid=tljp1335052550251024&q=egypt+cottage+newcastle&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x487e70bf65cfccff:0x61f661cd334549fa,Egypt+Cottage,+117+City+Rd,+Newcastle+upon+Tyne+NE1+2AN&gl=uk&ei=EEmTT8uKJ4mA8wPM5unODA&sa=X&oi=geocode_result&ct=image&resnum=1&sqi=2&ved=0CDUQ8gEwAA
You may have to "cut and paste" it but, if it comes up with the map, click the picture of the pub on the left and you should get the street view.
If you can get the link, the structure to the right of the pub, which leads to the building behind the pub, is the origin of the name "The Tube". The building is part of the old Tyne Tees Television set-up. The "Egypt Cottage" itself is the pub they used to drink in. Pan left (or move further down the street in that direction) and you'll see the main Tyne Tees Television building. All those TT-TV buildings are gone now.
The street is called City Road and further along is the Travelodge hotel I met some DS/MK fans in, prior to an MK show at City Hall a few years back.
-
So I guess it has to be an initiative from the channel (Channel 4 in this case) to release it, or to re-broadcast it in his integrity... Isnt it?
Any idea to start a campaign to promove it?
A rebroadcast would be great but it depends of the contractual clause. You can own the tape but not the right to make new airplay after initial one, especially for concert recording.
-
I sent an e-mail to channel 4 with this answer:
Thank you for contacting Channel 4 Viewer Enquiries regarding DIRE STRAITS LIVE IN '85.
Unfortunately we have no plans to repeat this programme at present, however please be assured your request has been noted and logged with our scheduling department.
Also we don't automatically have the rights to release the programmes we broadcast on DVD and for those we do, as a rule we tend to choose titles to release that we feel will be financially viable. Unfortunately, this particular programme was not released through Channel 4 DVD or any other distributor that we are aware of.
As we are sure you can appreciate, we receive hundreds of requests for copies of programmes that were not released commercially, therefore, Channel 4's policy is that we do not provide one-off copies.
I am sorry that we are unable to help with your request.
Thank you again for taking the time to contact us here at Channel 4, we hope you continue to enjoy our programming.
-
I've always thought it really too bad that we never had an official release from DS at the peak of their popularity. Commercially it would have been a great money maker at the time too even so shortly after Alchemy. They could have just done a video with no album deal or something like that to make it a little different. :-\
-
Some TV companies will sell "non-broadcast" copies (that is, good quality copies but lower than broadcast standards) and some will not. Another problem is that, often, technology has moved on and the TV companies do not have the equipment required to play (and thus copy) their original recording witht he equipment they use currently. This can mean that, to make a copy, they would need to set up the required equipment specially and, even if they would sell a copy, it will be expensive. Of course, some TV companies will have transferred some of their old recordings to a digital format already but some will not have done this. Again, it is a question of cost, particualrly if they see little prospect of exploiting the digital copy commercially. And as the e-mail says, there is the question of rights to consider, too.
May I suggest, jbaent, that you get back to Channel 4 and ask if it is possible to obtain photocopies of their documents relating to this recording. Actually, I have no idea whether Channel 4 retains paper archives at all nor for how long but it's worth a shot. I know that the BBC keep reasonably good paper files, going back years, and I know that some researchers have been able to get copies from their files. There may be copies of letters, contracts, details of exactly what was recorded, releases for the broadcast of particular tracks and the like. The BBC probably does this because it is a public service broadcaster but Channel 4 is, legally, a public service broadcaster, too, though one that has a commercial income stream. Obviously, you need to express great disappointment at their previous reply and ask if they can help with your research on the band.
The other possibility is that Channel 4 used an outside sub-contractor to make the recording, rather than it's own staff. If this is so and you can get their contact details, that is another route of enquiry.
-
I think its better that you (twm) or any of the british forumers do that, when you send a "Question" or "Request" you have to fill a formulary with a UK adresss, postal code etc. I obviously put a fake one, and I cant remember which, so if they track my questions, they will notice ;D
However, what about start a petition directed to the Channel 4 to try them to release the Wembley 85 in dvd?
http://www.thepetitionsite.com/create.html (http://www.thepetitionsite.com/create.html)
Do you think that with the apropiate help of forumers and fans around the (ww)world we could get signs enough? How many of us are here, in facebook, etc etc?
Do you think it worths the try?
-
The Tube was a Tyne-Tees Television production for Channel 4 so perhaps we should look there. Now known as ITV Tyne-Tees, they are the ITV company that cover the north east of England i.e. Newcastle.
A bit from Wikipedia:
"In 1979, Tyne Tees launched two national series, Alright Now and Check it Out, the latter a mix of rock music and segments on youth-oriented social issues; among performances by established acts, the two shows offered early exposure to bands linked to the North East, notably Dire Straits and The Police."
Anyone remember Supergran? Thanks a lot TT-TV! :D
-
The most important thing first: yes, of course I remember Supergran, though I probably remember Iain Cuthbertson as The Scunner more than Supergran herself, though I can just about picture her in my mind. My eldest loved the programme. The Scunner was the nickname of the baddie in this children's series.
For those overseas (and many south of the England-Scotland border, too), "scunner" is one of those truly wonderful Scots words, referring to anyone or anything that really disgusts you. So, a mother might refer to a child who has done some terrible deed as a "wee scunner"; similarly, someone who had an unfortunate experience with, for example, Thai food, might say, "I took a right scunner to that Thai food". So, just from his nickname, you can gather that The scunner was the object of loathing and disgust, though in a slightly comedic way in this instance. It was a Children's programme, after all.. I'm not sure if "scunner" is a word used throughout Scotland or just in the West of Scotland.
Moving now to DS and the programme in question. I'm afraid I'm not the person for this task. This is not because I lack the chutzpah (I've done it in the case of a Dylan TV programme and that was from one side of the Atlantic Ocean to the other) but because I am not much of a DS fan, as I have said before.
Maybe there is someone over here who would be prepared to try.
Finally, the petition. I doubt it would have a positive effect but anything is worth a try.
-
I guess that whether or not Wembley'85, arguably the most wanted and acclaimed DS concert, will be released on DVD/Blu-Ray, depends on two key questions:
1/Would this be a commercial success ? To answer this question, we need to know whether or not the 2010 Alchemy release was a commercial success. Unfortunately I seriously doubt it. On Amazon.com, Alchemy is nowhere near the top charts. And this was considered the "seminal" live recording (even if DMG calls it overrated :p), so I seriously doubt that Wembley would do better commercially... Does anybody has some serious sales figures for Alchemy ?
2/Would Mark ok it ? Again I seriously doubt it, for several reasons. First, Mark does not give a damn about the past, we all know this; second, he must now be rather angry with Alan Clark, with all the controversies with "The Straits", and would certainly not favour a recording that would put M. Clark in the light again; third, the musical style of Wembley'85 is not close to Mark's current style. These overdriven drums and guitar, these overused synth, these long breaks... all things that Mark is probably kind of ashamed of nowadays, something like "I did so many stupidities when I was young, and I was dressed like a pig, moreover" :) Somehow Alchemy, with less artificial overdrive and synth, its more "raw" feeling, is closer to what Mark is doing now, and maybe that's why he ok'ed it. Even the dress code is a bit less outdated (the red jacket and shoes, the famous "arrows" T-shirt, all this is -a bit- less ridiculous that this "80s" sleeveless blue shirt and these strange pants :)
What do you guys think ?
-
Alchemy did at least make sense in that it was an official production and release to begin with. I have no idea about sales figures, but I'm pretty sure it was mostly fans who bought it, hence sales figures can't be that high. The Wembley show should in my opinion attract even less attention, so why would anyone bother to release it? Mark doesn't care (neither for musical reasons nor financial reasons), the record company (who'd have get the rights to the show) doesn't care (unless they'd play the nostalgia game and go "remember 85? Remember your first CD? Remember that band? Relive it now! On DVD and Blu-ray, in surround sound!").
-
Well then we shall be contented with what we have...ok, to make you feel better, let's build our own official releases Wembley'85 alternatative:
- So Far Away is cool on Wembley, but it's not the best version (the Sydney 86 Calypso one is), so why not watching the one with Emmylou on the RLRR DVD ? Less energectic, but better voice blend, and nice strong finale :)
- Walk of Life is... well, I don't care :) You just got plenty of alternatives (On The Night, A Night In London, Chet Atkins & Friends)
- Private Investigations is really strong and nice on Wembley, but the On The Night version, while a bit less energetic, has a more hauting sound and extra sax.
- Sultans of Swing is fabulous on Wembley, but a lot prefer Alchemy, for the stronger sound and the lack of sax; if you can't live without sax, buy the Live Aid 4-DVD pack; this version is not as good as Wembley (I guess they were more nervous and couldn't soundcheck properly), but still quite kick-ass.
- Why Worry is really nice on Wembley, with strong piano playing from Alan; however some find the backing vocals (John, Chris, Guy and Jack) incredibly cheesy. Why not cheking out the version of the Chet Atkins & friends DVD with the Everly brothers ? a bit cheesy synth, but such a great voice blend; if you can't do without Mark's voice, the soft version with Emmylou on the RLRR DVD is quite nice; if this is too soft for you, you can still try to find the 2009 Hurlingham version with flute on i-concerts ("An evening with MK"), wonderful too.
- Brothers is Arms is really strong and powerful on Wembley; the On the Night version is unfortunately less powerful, but somehow more breathtaking, a really killer one as well.
- Money for Nothing is super powerful on Wembley; but the vocal intro is controversial... if you can't leave without it, see Live Aid (with Sting unfortunately even more out of tune than Jack Sonni on Wembley); but if you can, check out the Montserrat DVD version with Eric Clapton: the most powerful ever !
- Solid Rock is powerful on Wembley, but the On The Night version is ever better, for once on this DVD they have great fun on stage !
- Going Home with Henk B. Marvin is quite unique on Wembley; but some find it a bit too fast, and the Alchemy version a bit more natural and touching.
- Tunnel of Love is... well, better than Alchelmy, as said before; does not mean that Alchemy is bad, though, it is still quite a masterpiece.
- The same can be said of Expresso Love.
- The Man's too strong.... well, no alternative for this one. Too bad, it is really cool. But hey, that's the only one.
So it's not as if we don't have killer versions of almost everything on video, folks; and we've got OUATITW and Telegraph Road on Alchemy, which are among the best ever; and we've got plenty of versions of RAJ, with or without sax; and we've got Your laster trick on the On the Night DVD, plus 5 songs from the On Every Street Album; and we've got DTTW and WDYTYRG, plus Les Boys and the unreleased Making Movies Song, on the BBC Arena fabulous documentary; and we've got a high-quality version of TOL in the Old Grey Whiste Test in 1980...
So, as far as DS is concerned, we are not in dire straits (ah, ah). As far as Mark's solo career is concerned, this is different. We've got Golden Heart pretty well covered, we've got a killer version of Speedway on the RLRR DVD, we've got a killer version of WAM from 2002 on itunes, we've got nice unique stuff from the ATTR album (think of I Dug A Diamond), but.... it is a real crime to have no recent gem, like Hill Farmer Blues, Marbletown, Coyote, Border Reiver, Piper to the End.... and What It is !
Well, I guess this is what it is... (ah ah again)
-
I knew it...
:(
-
Wembley 85 is owned by Channel 4 not the BBC
Whatever it is, the BBC4 documentary "MK - a life in songs" is showing some excerpts of Wembley 85, so they get have access to it... And release it on blu ray ! Maybe even with the missing tracks like RATR, of they find the Original tapes before mixing, unlike what they did for alchemy...
The entire broadcast is on Youtube though. If all they needed was 30 seconds of footage, they could have just downloaded it from Youtube and converted it. The BBC contacted AMIT to use a photo of MK on our site in the documentary, so that doesn't really say much for the BBC's archive. ;) (No offense to the BBC.)
-
The entire broadcast is on Youtube though. If all they needed was 30 seconds of footage, they could have just downloaded it from Youtube and converted it. The BBC contacted AMIT to use a photo of MK on our site in the documentary, so that doesn't really say much for the BBC's archive. ;) (No offense to the BBC.)
The video & sound quality on the documentary seemed very good though, better than my video bootleg of Wembley'85.
This bootleg would be enough for me... if Tunnel of Love and Solid Rock had been broadcasted on radio with FM quality (the one that was used for the song of the other songs). TOL sound taken from 1986 TV is quite bad, it also changes pace and tune half-way through... so thinking that somewhere in the vault taking dust you have the full concert in great quality makes me sick to my stomach. Anwyay...
-
Dan, I did a response to two of Herlock's postings (#66 and #68) and, even though it wasn't that long, it seems to have disappeared into the aether.
As for the BBC archive, they have kept the paper documents that relate to their own broadcasts and a wide range of actual radio and television broadcasts. As for photographs, the BBC used to own the Hulton photo archive but that got sold, quite a few years back, to Getty Images. This was at a time when Getty, realising what was happening with digitisation and the way the wind was beginning to blow, were buying up a number of photographic archives in order to continue to be a major player in the "new photo archiving world". Another example was their purchase of Archive Photographs, a company based in NYC but with, as I recall, a facility in New Jersey - your neck of the woods, Dan - although it may be that Archive Photos moved to a Getty facility in New Jersey. Anyway, may be the BBC does not have access to a particular photo or to a suitable photo from a particular period or particular event. It is also possible that, although the programme is being made for the BBC, it is actually being made by an outside company. What did they tell you when they made the request?
Incidentally, I was approached earlier this year by the "History Detectives" people (working for PBS-TV) who are doing something on Dylan and were seeking a particular, brief video clip. It is the way things are done.
-
Hi TWM,
Could you send me your posts by PM, waiting for the technical problem to be solved ?
Thanks and cheers
-
jbaent, if you start something I will back you up! Unfortunately I am in Greece, so I can not initiate things. I believe that some things are worth doing, just to see what will happen. So carry on and let me know if there is anything I can help you with.
-
jbaent, if you start something I will back you up! Unfortunately I am in Greece, so I can not initiate things. I believe that some things are worth doing, just to see what will happen. So carry on and let me know if there is anything I can help you with.
It doesnt worth. Its very easy to say "How I wish that they would release it on dvd" but when someone says "Lets do something" the answer is always "well..."
Im spanish and I
-
I'm shocked you got a response, jbaent. I wouldn't have even bothered. I think the only shot we have at getting anything pre-broadcast for 7/10/85 is getting in contact with someone that produced, edited, directed (even filmed) the show...etc... and see if they want to part with a copy they may have made for $$$. (Obviously, this may be illegal, but you get the idea...) In fact, that was the case with Basel, 6/28/92, as a pre-broadcast source was discovered about six years ago. Unfortunately, the pre-broadcast copy only included a minute or two before DS came on stage and a minute or so post-show. The quality was only marginally better than the well known broadcast versions.
-
If enough UK resident does ask ITV/Channel4 for a new broadcast maybe they would condsider doing it. I think this is what we can expect as the less complicated thing.
-
If enough UK resident does ask ITV/Channel4 for a new broadcast maybe they would condsider doing it. I think this is what we can expect as the less complicated thing.
So?