A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: Love Expresso on December 09, 2011, 10:59:33 PM
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Hi, I was watching last year's great BBC dokumentary this evening and found the sentence about the "disappointment that Communiqu
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Im always torn between communique and love over gold for my favourite DS album. When I was a kid I spent alot of time by the sea fishing listening to communique.
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Couldn't agree more...I've always felt that Communique is the most under-appreciated of all the DS albums. I would love to hear "Single Handed Sailor", "News", "Where do you think you're going" or "Once upon a time in the west" dusted off and played live again :lol..not gonna happen..but fun to think about the possibility ;D.
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communique is my most favorite DS album of all time and IMO the best ! Every song is a gem.
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It's my favourite DS album too! :)
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There's nothing not to love about their second LP. I think the negative press came from the lack of a single, equal to that of Sultans. But really, the whole record is a cohesive gem, and the fluidity of Marks playing on this record is incredible.
Definitely one to take if stuck on a desert island. :)
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Communique has always been my favourite.
Closely followed by either 'Dire Straits'
or 'Love over gold'.
Cheers. BBB
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lol, yeah shame ONLY sold about 8 million copies.... lamo. People would kill to sell that many albums. It's highly regarded as my fav DS album (although we all know it's impossible to really have a fav). Luckily I was only 3 when the album came out, so I was never the wiser about its apparent disappointment. Amazing album, with Lady Writer, News and the wonderful Single Handed Sailor :)
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lol, yeah shame ONLY sold about 8 million copies.... lamo. People would kill to sell that many albums. It's highly regarded as my fav DS album (although we all know it's impossible to really have a fav). Luckily I was only 3 when the album came out, so I was never the wiser about its apparent disappointment. Amazing album, with Lady Writer, News and the wonderful Single Handed Sailor :)
I too was only 3 when it was released and guessed that maybe the fans that liked the slightly rougher edged sound of the first album were a little disappointed by the smoother sound of Communique. At least that's what I thought at the time. ;)
I certainly prefer the first one, followed by Making Movies and LOG. There are too many average tracks on Communique for me like News, Follow me Home, Angel of Mercy but also some great songs too like Single Handed Sailor and Once Upon a Time... Of course having said all that it's still a great album and when I say "average tracks" I mean in comparison to the best tracks on the album!
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Communique is one of my favorite DS/MK albums.
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I too was only 3 when it was released and guessed that maybe the fans that liked the slightly rougher edged sound of the first album were a little disappointed by the smoother sound of Communique. At least that's what I thought at the time. ;)
wow, you were quite smart for a 3 year old!
Communique is also my fav DS album
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I too was only 3 when it was released and guessed that maybe the fans that liked the slightly rougher edged sound of the first album were a little disappointed by the smoother sound of Communique. At least that's what I thought at the time. ;)
wow, you were quite smart for a 3 year old!
It's been all downhill since then, I can assure you!
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So you all are a wonderful bunch of people with great taste in music obviously! :lol :lol
LE
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Communiqu
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single handed sailor, where do you think you're going, lady writer, ...etc..etc.........
need i say more...
WDYTYG is BRILLIANT on the 81 bootlegs...
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So it seems to be a favorite or near favorite album for many many folks. Where did all this 'underrated' thing come from then? ;)
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So it seems to be a favorite or near favorite album for many many folks. Where did all this 'underrated' thing come from then? ;)
Probably by the reasons I gave in my previous post?
;)
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I remember I was about 14 when I copied Communique from a CD my cousin had to tape. I was visiting a town close where my uncle lived, and I listened to the tape over and over again. When I was going to travel back home - it was about a six-hour journey - I was devastated I didn't have my Walkman with me. I just loved that album! Partiularly Follow Me Home made an impact on me at that time. Back at school, my classmate took my headphones and heard Single Handed Sailor and said "what is this? blues???" Haha. I was so out of sync with my classmates. But Communique was definitely the album that hit home with me the most and I guess is the one that I like best today. It's funny - Making Movies is the album that many critics hail as DS' best. Personally, I think it's the worst, speaking just about my personal taste.
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I remember I was about 14 when I copied Communique from a CD my cousin had to tape. I was visiting a town close where my uncle lived, and I listened to the tape over and over again. When I was going to travel back home - it was about a six-hour journey - I was devastated I didn't have my Walkman with me. I just loved that album! Partiularly Follow Me Home made an impact on me at that time. Back at school, my classmate took my headphones and heard Single Handed Sailor and said "what is this? blues???" Haha. I was so out of sync with my classmates. But Communique was definitely the album that hit home with me the most and I guess is the one that I like best today. It's funny - Making Movies is the album that many critics hail as DS' best. Personally, I think it's the worst, speaking just about my personal taste.
I never listen to Making Movies even though it has Tunnel of Love, to get a fix of that I prefer a live version.
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There's something about the way Mark sings on MM that I find awful. Maybe that's why Romeo and Juliet was used as an example in Mark's entry on the Worst Singer list.
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the one song that i prefer in it's original version is Solid rock, it was never performed as fresh and "agressive" as on the MM record.
then there's the beautiful Hand in Hand...
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the one song that i prefer in it's original version is Solid rock, it was never performed as fresh and "agressive" as on the MM record.
then there's the beautiful Hand in Hand...
Yes, and the demo version of Solid Rock is maybe even more agressively performed.
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I generally prefer MK/DS songs live over the album versions. The major exception to that is Money For Nothing. I've still not heard a live version that sounds as clean and crisp as the original.
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I generally prefer MK/DS songs live over the album versions. The major exception to that is Money For Nothing. I've still not heard a live version that sounds as clean and crisp as the original.
The only thing about the album version of MFN is that the outro just repeats the opening riff. A nice jam would have lifted the song but it's just typical of Mark to underplay on an album like that isn't it!
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There's something about the way Mark sings on MM that I find awful. Maybe that's why Romeo and Juliet was used as an example in Mark's entry on the Worst Singer list.
I find the MM album lacks some bass in the mix compared to all the others. But songs like Hand in Hand and Les Boys have a melodic beauty that I always enjoy.
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lol, yeah shame ONLY sold about 8 million copies.... lamo. People would kill to sell that many albums. It's highly regarded as my fav DS album (although we all know it's impossible to really have a fav). Luckily I was only 3 when the album came out, so I was never the wiser about its apparent disappointment. Amazing album, with Lady Writer, News and the wonderful Single Handed Sailor :)
I too was only 3 when it was released and guessed that maybe the fans that liked the slightly rougher edged sound of the first album were a little disappointed by the smoother sound of Communique. At least that's what I thought at the time. ;)
I certainly prefer the first one, followed by Making Movies and LOG. There are too many average tracks on Communique for me like News, Follow me Home, Angel of Mercy but also some great songs too like Single Handed Sailor and Once Upon a Time... Of course having said all that it's still a great album and when I say "average tracks" I mean in comparison to the best tracks on the album!
Phew... you saved yourself at the end there ;) News is a fabulous song to me... beautiful guitar solo. Wonderful album all round :)
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single handed sailor, where do you think you're going, lady writer, ...etc..etc.........
need i say more...
WDYTYG is BRILLIANT on the 81 bootlegs...
WDYTYG from '81 is amazing, I totally agree. The feeling he puts into playing that song is astounding. Wow
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Communiqu
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communique, no discussion ds1984
:-)
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Strange thing I like Communique very much. I remember there is another thread with a poll that clearly shows that Communique is the favourite amongst us. Anyway, I was also 3 when it came out, but when I first heard it when I was 14 years old, I surely had the vivid impression that Single-handed sailor sounded familiar. Anyway Follow me home was written during vacation in Crete, Greece and both waves, priest-rocks references and easy going guitar-bass-drums, make a good sound image of Greece during summer. Come to Greece for vacation. (the subliminal message...)
Anyway the song I like least in Communique, is Communique itself! Nice licks, nice piano, but doesn't click for me. And yes all other songs are terrific. Angel of mercy, Portobello belle, Single handed sailor, and the whole A-side, but Communique.
Odd thing, I never liked Romeo and Juliet that much, skipped it when I listened to MM. And Les boys is good fun and very short. And yes, I find Hand in hand very good, and Solid rock a bit tiring in the MM version. On the other hand the version found in the "Riding high" movie soundtrack, is very nice indeed.
There is not such thing as an underrated album for DS. They all have sold by the truckload, and receive regular air play even today. Of course BiA with the 30 millions make all other albums seem underrated but truth is the term underrated means that there is a wish from someone that these albums sold better and heard more. But this is a matter of taste and, in reality, target groups with same interests tend to think that the "crossover" albums, containing new sounds that appeal to a wider audience, are a bit "treacherous", so usually they stick to the pure sound of earlier work. ( OK, something like that, but this do not stand for DS fans.)
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I must admit I rarely listen to DS these days, but when I do, it is usually either Dire Straits or Communique. The "wonderful" Brothers is probably the most boring album.
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I like it too! Nice news - it will be released (as well as MM and AL) by Universal on SHM -SACD in February 2012.
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I like it too! Nice news - it will be released (as well as MM and AL) by Universal on SHM -SACD in February 2012.
Is there any software to "translate" that SACD to dvd-audio or dts cds? I mean, something that people could listen to without having to buy a new player?
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I like it too! Nice news - it will be released (as well as MM and AL) by Universal on SHM -SACD in February 2012.
Is there any software to "translate" that SACD to dvd-audio or dts cds? I mean, something that people could listen to without having to buy a new player?
I have exactly the same problem, but I also don't have a 5.1 system. I know from a friend that there are SACD compatible DVD players, around 70 Euros. I ill not buy one, since I will need to buy a 5.1 PA system and maybe a new TV (mine is barely 12'') but if you have the rest you are only 70 Euros away!
Generally I do not recommend buying new machines, but I guess there are limited ways to rip the SACD information and put them on a CD. Too bad they don't put out for sale the nice audio DVDs like they did with BiA 20th anniversary (although I can't enjoy this either without 5.1)
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what's AL?
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I guess it is ALchemy... ???
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I like it too! Nice news - it will be released (as well as MM and AL) by Universal on SHM -SACD in February 2012.
Is there any software to "translate" that SACD to dvd-audio or dts cds? I mean, something that people could listen to without having to buy a new player?
Yes, it's possible now. But first step is not simple. You have to have an old SONY PS3 to rip SACD iso. Next step is easy:
1) you can convert it to PCM and make a DVD-Audio (software for converstion: A) Korg AudioGate for stereo (free) B) Foobar with SACD plugin for stereo/multichannel (free) C) Weiss Saracon SRC for stereo and multichannel (very expensive )).
2) Or use Foobar with plugin to listen to SACD iso or diff files (DSD to PCM converation "on fly").
All Universlal SHM-SACD made in Japan - stereo only - flat transfer from analog tapes. Making Movies and Alchemy will be relased on SHM-SACD too.
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All Universlal SHM-SACD made in Japan - stereo only - flat transfer from analog tapes. Making Movies and Alchemy will be relased on SHM-SACD too.
So, its gonna be just stereo SACD? no surround mix?
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All Universlal SHM-SACD made in Japan - stereo only - flat transfer from analog tapes. Making Movies and Alchemy will be relased on SHM-SACD too.
So, its gonna be just stereo SACD? no surround mix?
Yes, stereo only.
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Alchemy DVD and Blue ray is remixed in surround 5.1, so I really don't get the SACD stereo reissue. As a matter of fact I understand why they do it, (Money money money mOney!) but I wonder why the artists don't see that their fans are taken for a ride to the bank, to cash their desires. Neil Young and many other issue their NEW albums as 5.1 surround DVD and audio CD combo, for a regular price and vinyl replica cover! I will pass this time, since there are no extras or even 5.1 that any way I am unable to listen to and enjoy. And anyway I have heard of the albums so many times (let alone buy them several times over) that I don't know if it is worth it. I guess Guy would answer the same way he replied about Get Lucky deluxe 100 pounds: "Bargain". Any thoughts on the matter, other than "if you don't like, don't buy?" I come to wonder lately, about the "extra" song in the compilations of my favourite artists. If the compilations were intended for the general population, and not just the fans, there wouldn't be any extra tracks. But it seems that the fans are a considerable part of the consuming force even for compilations.
Now that the world has only 3 major record companies that amount to the 90% of the whole music "business" and Universal is one of them, such stands will become more regular. We were used to such things from Pink Floyd that have not actually produced any new music over two decades, or Led Zeppelin or whoever, but at least their overpriced-repackaged product has bits of extras. Not much for the price we are expected to pay or for the quality of the extras, but it is a nice way to say rip off and keeping pretensions at the same time. For the sake of music, why kill the goose that lays the golden eggs, meaning the buying audience, forcing them to download music, legally or otherwise.
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I must admit I rarely listen to DS these days, but when I do, it is usually either Dire Straits or Communique. The "wonderful" Brothers is probably the most boring album.
Get out!!!!! ;) BIA is just a wonderful album IMO. Ride Across the River and BIA in particular are stunning
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Get out!!!!! ;) BIA is just a wonderful album IMO. Ride Across the River and BIA in particular are stunning
The songs are good, but the production and "sound" are to me very dull. Guy has said this about BIA:
That album was recorded 20 years ago during the initial excitement of digital recording. we didn't really know what we were doing, no-one did. The album sounds pretty naff to me compared to what we get up to nowdays. We incorporate analog simply because we all now know it has a sound that lasts and is particularly pleasing on the ear.
I agree.
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Get out!!!!! ;) BIA is just a wonderful album IMO. Ride Across the River and BIA in particular are stunning
The songs are good, but the production and "sound" are to me very dull. Guy has said this about BIA:
That album was recorded 20 years ago during the initial excitement of digital recording. we didn't really know what we were doing, no-one did. The album sounds pretty naff to me compared to what we get up to nowdays. We incorporate analog simply because we all now know it has a sound that lasts and is particularly pleasing on the ear.
I agree.
Yeah I agree with the recording side of things. That's what happens when you try new fully digital technology for the first time I suppose. The albums these days are so organic, they sound wonderful.
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I think this is exactly why it sounds so good; because it was an example of DS exactly at the forefront of album production at that era. In other words, it defines the mid 80s in sound.
Guy is always going on about how great the most recent things are anyway as we all know so we can take that as Guy being polite and ever so reliable to Mark. A stand up guy you could say!
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It's funny - I always thought of Communique as my least favourite DS album (apart from the awful OES which I've never bought)
But playing in a DS tribute band I had to go through the back catalogue and decide which songs to do. Surprised myself by choosing more songs off thus album than any other. Id still put DS and LOG ahead of it, but it has some of MKs very best songs.
The other thing that surprised me was that apart from RandJ and Tunnel - which are, admittedly, two extraordinarily good songs, MM is a bit of a disappointment listening to it again after a few years away. Starts off genius, then slowly tumbles away to mediocraty and by the end (les boys) is actually awful.
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Peculiar think to see it from a distance, and 35 years from the first album is a pretty big distance. But MM and BiA must be the only DS albums that actually were in "line" with the music trends of the time they were released. On the other hand, both albums are full of songs that stand the test of time, a feature other albums from those times fail to accomplice, either production wise or as as ... solid compositions.
Surely MM has a production that is not indicative of the time it was recorded, while BiA, shouts "EIGHTIES". Then again, if you listen-compare with the other million seller artist, Bruce Springsteen, who also had an album full of good songs released a year before, you will find that the synth sound is the one that did the damage. I still like both albums, but listening to Born in the USA, I find the production and instrumentation somehow dated, while BiA is more like showing "where it came from", than age. Such a pity, since his 1980 album The river, recorded by Neil Dorfsman (ring a bell?) is as timeless as MM sound.
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( the awful OES which I've never bought)
how can you find it awful if you have never bought it, and therefore, one would assume, never listened to as God (or Mark at least ;) ) intended (as a whole, on some proper equipment, more than once)
just wondering...
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( the awful OES which I've never bought)
how can you find it awful if you have never bought it, and therefore, one would assume, never listened to as God (or Mark at least ;) ) intended (as a whole, on some proper equipment, more than once)
just wondering...
Now Rollergirl, you are pulling the same stand you did to me with "Kill to get Crimson". ;) Well I tell you it ain't gonna work, because OES is actually a terrific album. :lol Only the three international singles were below average, (Calling Elvis is unbearable to listen, don't try and change my mind >:( ). But the fact that he never bought it, is not a good argument. Do you buy all the clothes you try on? I try many albums and only buy the ones with the best artwork. And Dire straits always had the best covers ;D
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Haha! you got me Vgonis, I am going on one of my crusades again ;D.
Personally, I can only judge if I like an album or not by listening to it and by listening to it, I mean the way I described earlier.
I am curious about how others do it.
(And of the record I never tried to change your mind about what you like or not, I just reacted at the way you expressed your dislike of KTGC by saying it is poor songwritting )
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( the awful OES which I've never bought)
how can you find it awful if you have never bought it, and therefore, one would assume, never listened to as God (or Mark at least ;) ) intended (as a whole, on some proper equipment, more than once)
just wondering...
Ive heard it enough to know. The Bug is a decent song, no more - the rest just sounds like lift music and/or an attempt to replicate the formula of BIA that doesn't come off.
Not surprised MK called time on DS after that - he'd run out of steam with the project. The fact he got back to writing good songs again after going solo shows it was a good call.
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OES was the first CD I bought, at the age of 15, and I think I played it to death. As with most other things, music should be enjoyed in moderation or at least the "diet" should be varied. I've had my share of musical overdoses, first it was DS, then it was bluegrass. Too much bluegrass these days makes me feel physically sick, and any attempt at running through the entire DS catalog only makes me sympathize all the more with Mark's desire to move on.
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PONO is nothing but incredibly outstanding.
OES is a dark album and is in the same vein of Communiqu
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Phono? Wtf?
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I'm guessing "Planet of New Orleans"..just a guess mind you.
Don't know why anyone would completely neglect OES..."Calling Elvis", "Iron Hand", "When it comes to you" and the title cut are good songs.
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OES still stands up as a very good album. Better now in fact than it was when it came out and it was overhyped to an extent.
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I know lots of people who really like OES, but for me it just sticks out as the one where MK overcomplicated his playing and the production in order to cover up for weak songs - to quote dustyvalentino's sig, he was trying to polish a doo-doo.
Compare the songs on OES to the stuff from the first four albums, or some of the songs on Sailing to Philadelphia for instance, and they're just not in the same class.
Each to their own though - just my tastes I guess.
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OES is my least fav DS album too
I think that DS would have been more a "cult" rock band if it ended up with BIA
I've discovered DS in 88 when they were no longer in vogue
The mandela gig was a sort of reunion, with " a tear in the eyes" like they were introduced, but I thought that it was "over", DS would be a band of the past. And it had a certain "aura"
Then came OES, and it made a strange feeling to me : I was glad to hear new songs from my fav band, and was able to see them in concert, but in the same time, I knew it wasn't the "real" DS, and it lost part of his magic feeling.
It looked like a commercial comme back, with Virgin sponsor and so on.
and the gig I attented in 92 was abit disapointed to me : far from the stage, standard setlist, no surprises, etc...
I had far far more fun in 96
Sometimes I think that if I've never saw DS live, it would have been more "cult" in my mind, thinking of the 80 era.
The OES era ruined a bit the magic I put in this band.
Don't get me wrong, I like some OES songs, and some live arrangements in 91-92, but it doesn't reach e.g. the alchemy era in my heart
a little bit the same : I saw Pink Floyd in 94, but to me, it wasn't really PF (arrrgh....when a friend of mine said to me he saw the dark side tour......)
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dude, i LOVED the 1994 Floyd show i saw in Werchter, it was, to this day, the most brilliant show experience i have seen, and only (what a surprise) the Wall show i saw this year came close to it.
i was always more of a Gilmour man then a Waters man.
and as much as i appreciate his brilliant texts, he would have been far less interesting without the golden touch man that is Gilmour, his sense of "music" is unrivalled.
did i mention The Division bell is a great album, it's on replay for the past week, in my car.
actually it is the first song (Cluster One, never played live) and Marooned that are being replayed.
i love the way you hear all these nature sounds, and frozen grass breaking under footsteps until, after 3:00 when the first note is heard, ..the whole (instrumental) song is fantastic.
try it.
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Wrong thread, Pottel? Or maybe wrong forum??? Haha.
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Yes I know Division bell of course, it's a bit like Floyd's OES to me ;)
great guitar tones, perfect production sound.....but it lacks some soul, some genius, some heartbeat, some...... can't explain in words
I agree that Gilmour's golden touch makes Floyd's music immediately recognizable.
Of course, many Floyd tunes are based on David's voice and guitar, Rick's keyboards, and "in the end" Roger's lyrics
But, altough I'm more into Gilmour than Waters, I think that David was never better than during Waters era !
A bit paradoxal, but IMHO, David expressed his golden touch more through Roger's ideas, than in his solo or last Floyd works.
Money is a typical example : a song written and composed by Waters, but "transcended" by Gilmour.
This song would never habe been what we know without Gilmour's singing and playing, but it's a Waters song !
Cluster one or Marrooned......mmmmm.......To me, Floyd is : Echoes, Dark side, Shine On, Dogs, Atom heart mother...
About 94 shows, yes it was great memories : fireworks, gigantic stage, fabulous sound, audio-visual experience....yes it was.......but IMHO far far far from Animals tour, Wembley 74, pre-album versions of Dogs and sheep, and so on....
I remember a journalist saying this : the Floyd lost his genius in late 60 (Barett) and lost his soul in 80' (Waters), and I agree with that : the Floyd markIII is a polished, clean, perfect sounding, nice, brillant shell....but an empty shell
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do not agree. end of story :-)
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do not agree. end of story :-)
I agree ;D
I mean I agree with you saying you don't agree.
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OK, I admit I was a bit harsh :)
I like to listen to Division bell, and I confess that delicate sound of thunder is playing in my car ;D
I just wanted to say that theses Floyd albums lacks some magic of a cultissime band which was and still is a monument in rock history, but mainly during the late 60 and the 70, I'm afraid not in the 80 and the 90 :)
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Hey get a Divison Bell - I like! thread on your own! :P
LE
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Hey get a Divison Bell - I like! thread on your own! :P
LE
I'm waiting for that thread to comment on Communiqu
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dcks-aMij5s