A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: Rolo on January 03, 2022, 08:07:02 PM
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Some years ago, maybe 2010 or 2011, i asked to a brazilian producer if he wanted to bring DK to Brazil to do some concerts. He waved positively and later asked to me if i can e-mail DK for an initial approach.
I said: - Sure!
So i start to listen to all his albuns before the first contact and man... this guy have great songs.
Well, briefly resume, I made the contact, we sent some e-mails eachother, he is a very polited and funny guy... but the producer never made the final aproach and the concerts never happened.
After that, time to time, i listen some DK albuns and every new album i listen to it with attention.
I know we all love DS/MK and the JI albuns, but DK have some very great albuns.
I'm sure that you guys have listened a lot of DK's work.
So what is your DK favorite works?
In my opinion:
Best Album:
Ship Of Dreams
Wishbones
Release
Grace
Shooting For The Moon
Best Songs:
Mending My Nets
Easy Street
Somethimes There Are No Words
St Swithun's Day
Come To Me
Scarborough Fair
In other hand, DK have some, im my opinion, songs and albums that are not that great.
It's strange and understandable that DK escapes from his roots and, obviously, the DS sound.
His "Heavy Metal" era are defienetely not good.
His works have improved a lot after the release of The Giver (1993).
Nice to observe that DK's return to folk music during the Small Mercies album (1995) has some elements that i listened on MK's Get Lucky (2010).
The pinacle is the Ship Of Dreams album (2004). Great Songs, great album. After that seems to me that DK has keeping the same aspects of his music. Grace, Hearlands, Last Train Leaving...
His lastest album Sooting For The Moon its a good album.
I observe that DK's melodies/harmonies are very similar, especially when he plays the piano. And, for end my text, it's impossible to not compare to his big brother work. DK is now more a Folk Troubador that composes many ballads and some traditional folk style songs.
I believe that DK deserver more than the Founder of DS.
The Music Business was not nice with him.
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I have good memories from the albums:
Lifelines and Wishbones.
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Just received this latest album Shooting for the moon and I must admit, he made great albums in the past, but this one has again a lot of wonderful and stunning songs and is even better than anything he did in the past. DK is capble of delivering not only quantity (quite a lot of albums in relatively short time) but also great quality in songwriting and sound quality. You won’t regret buying it!
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My favorites are specially "The Giver", "Small Mercies", "Wishbones" and "Ship of dreams"
From his previous records to those, "Release" is very good as it's the first one, and from the later, "Shooting for the moon", his brand new, is very good, and also "Last train leaving" has something beautiful.
But if I had to recommend one, just one, that would be "Small Mercies".
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His "Heavy Metal" era are defienetely not good.
His works have improved a lot after the release of The Giver (1993).
Nice to observe that DK's return to folk music during the Small Mercies album (1995) has some elements that i listened on MK's Get Lucky (2010).
With "Heavy metal" era, I guess you means his record of the 80's, they are not heavy metal at all but kind of 80's Disco thing, with very heavy drum sounds on almost everything, a lot of synthetizers... Some good songs there but ruined by that sound.
David himself says those records (Behind the lines, Cut the wire etc) are the one he likes the less because they are very influenced by the trendy sounds of the 80's and the way his voice was recorded was not good, but those records were sons of their time. He likes more his records from "The Giver" to today.
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David is one of those artists you like because he sounds like someone you like very much. At least that’s how I feel about his music.
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I know it's a terrible thing to say, but DK to me sounds like a second-rate version of Mark, in every aspect. And I can't stand his singing voice.
He's a very intelligent man and writes sharp, incisive lyrics, but I can't listen to him.
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I know it's a terrible thing to say, but DK to me sounds like a second-rate version of Mark, in every aspect. And I can't stand his singing voice.
He's a very intelligent man and writes sharp, incisive lyrics, but I can't listen to him.
100% agree, I try to listen but just sounds like someone doing a bad MK impression.
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I always find funny when someone said that David sings like MK but worst, always sounds like people are saying he pretends to sound like MK.
He is not. It's his voice, they are brothers. There is nothing he can do to avoid that because, I insist, it's his voice.
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I always find funny when someone said that David sings like MK but worst, always sounds like people are saying he pretends to sound like MK.
He is not. It's his voice, they are brothers. There is nothing he can do to avoid that because, I insist, it's his voice.
Not saying he pretends to sound like MK, just saying I can't listen to him because of that.
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I'm the same unfortunately, I've tried to like but his material is just not for me...
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Same here!
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Can't imagine being David honestly. If I were him, I'd pursue a completely different walk of life, excuse the term. Probably out of music. If only his songs were on par with Mark's, then no problem. I know he has his audience, but I usually listen to all of his songs only once and never again. And yes, the thinking that he sounds like an MK cover band without an accent never escapes me. It's like listening to Frank Sinatra Jr., you just know it's not "the real deal", but only a relative.
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Just received this latest album Shooting for the moon and I must admit, he made great albums in the past, but this one has again a lot of wonderful and stunning songs and is even better than anything he did in the past. DK is capble of delivering not only quantity (quite a lot of albums in relatively short time) but also great quality in songwriting and sound quality. You won’t regret buying it!
Its a good album in my opinion too.
Its very traditional in terms of textures and instruments and have a nice vibe.
I have good memories from the albums:
Lifelines and Wishbones.
Lifelines is the album that i completely dislike.
The exception is the "strait" song 'Lonely Is The Night'.
If i not wrong, Lifelines was the latter tentative to bring DK to the spotlights. The album has a relative good production and was recorded in a great studio. But DK's declarations after album release were a little childish.
In my opinion, Lifelines is a confuse album with a lot of useless information.
Wishbones is a good album too.
Not so well recorded but a good one.
My favorites are specially "The Giver", "Small Mercies", "Wishbones" and "Ship of dreams"
From his previous records to those, "Release" is very good as it's the first one, and from the later, "Shooting for the moon", his brand new, is very good, and also "Last train leaving" has something beautiful.
But if I had to recommend one, just one, that would be "Small Mercies".
Good point.
I believe that DK is recording a lot of his stuff at home. His latest albums have a contemplative vibe. These songs, maybe, is his way to getting old.
Some good songs there but ruined by that sound.
HA!! That's true ;D
David is one of those artists you like because he sounds like someone you like very much. At least that’s how I feel about his music.
Agreed. But it's impossible not to compare him with his big brother. John's firsts albums, in my opinion, are not good either. But he's not a Knopfler and, i think that, the circumstances that involves DK solo career are always overshadowed by the Biggest Band In The World.
I know it's a terrible thing to say, but DK to me sounds like a second-rate version of Mark, in every aspect. And I can't stand his singing voice.
He's a very intelligent man and writes sharp, incisive lyrics, but I can't listen to him.
I think that mostly of us always expect some visual elements that MK's music have. David is a very simple guitar player, so, i think that the lack of guitar, for a DS fan, is a big syn.
I always find funny when someone said that David sings like MK but worst, always sounds like people are saying he pretends to sound like MK.
He is not. It's his voice, they are brothers. There is nothing he can do to avoid that because, I insist, it's his voice.
Totally agreed!
Can't imagine being David honestly. If I were him, I'd pursue a completely different walk of life, excuse the term. Probably out of music. If only his songs were on par with Mark's, then no problem. I know he has his audience, but I usually listen to all of his songs only once and never again. And yes, the thinking that he sounds like an MK cover band without an accent never escapes me. It's like listening to Frank Sinatra Jr., you just know it's not "the real deal", but only a relative.
I agree and i disagree.
It's clear that DK has pursued a different way in music to not to be compared with we know who.
He is not a band leader, seems to me that he is no leader at all.
So, i agree that, DK maybe should made his way out of the music. But... Music is his passion.
I don't think DK music sound like a MK cover band. Both has the same influences and some similarities are impossible to escape.
The problem is that MK is a genius.
Mk is a genius and a leader surrounded by great people that follow his ideas.
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Can't imagine being David honestly. If I were him, I'd pursue a completely different walk of life, excuse the term. Probably out of music. If only his songs were on par with Mark's, then no problem. I know he has his audience, but I usually listen to all of his songs only once and never again. And yes, the thinking that he sounds like an MK cover band without an accent never escapes me. It's like listening to Frank Sinatra Jr., you just know it's not "the real deal", but only a relative.
I agree and i disagree.
It's clear that DK has pursued a different way in music to not to be compared with we know who.
He is not a band leader, seems to me that he is no leader at all.
So, i agree that, DK maybe should made his way out of the music. But... Music is his passion.
I don't think DK music sound like a MK cover band. Both has the same influences and some similarities are impossible to escape.
The problem is that MK is a genius.
Mk is a genius and a leader surrounded by great people that follow his ideas.
Wow, that's a long answer Rolo! :lol Barely fits into my 27" 5K display.
Yes, I think David's leaving was a mistake, and I personally think that's why Mark disregarded him for so long. It's like he wanted to "make it" just like MK, and MK never wanted it. The problem with brothers is that you are either forever together like Phil and Tommy Emmanuel, or forever apart. And even Phil and Tommy made different things together, Phil would always play solos and Tommy played rhythm, and the fact that Tommy is way more successful and famous never made their relationships go stale.
And instead of going through DS together with his brother and enjoying life now like John, David make records by selling guitars his brother played on. That's ridiculous indeed! But everybody pays to play.
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Can't imagine being David honestly. If I were him, I'd pursue a completely different walk of life, excuse the term. Probably out of music. If only his songs were on par with Mark's, then no problem. I know he has his audience, but I usually listen to all of his songs only once and never again. And yes, the thinking that he sounds like an MK cover band without an accent never escapes me. It's like listening to Frank Sinatra Jr., you just know it's not "the real deal", but only a relative.
I agree and i disagree.
It's clear that DK has pursued a different way in music to not to be compared with we know who.
He is not a band leader, seems to me that he is no leader at all.
So, i agree that, DK maybe should made his way out of the music. But... Music is his passion.
I don't think DK music sound like a MK cover band. Both has the same influences and some similarities are impossible to escape.
The problem is that MK is a genius.
Mk is a genius and a leader surrounded by great people that follow his ideas.
Wow, that's a long answer Rolo! :lol Barely fits into my 27" 5K display.
Yes, I think David's leaving was a mistake, and I personally think that's why Mark disregarded him for so long. It's like he wanted to "make it" just like MK, and MK never wanted it. The problem with brothers is that you are either forever together like Phil and Tommy Emmanuel, or forever apart. And even Phil and Tommy made different things together, Phil would always play solos and Tommy played rhythm, and the fact that Tommy is way more successful and famous never made their relationships go stale.
And instead of going through DS together with his brother and enjoying life now like John, David make records by selling guitars his brother played on. That's ridiculous indeed! But everybody pays to play.
David is also politically active, something that Mark has always avoided. He can be quite rude to people who disagree with his political view which doesn’t tend to help someone in that kind of position.
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Wow, that's a long answer Rolo! :lol Barely fits into my 27" 5K display.
Yes, I think David's leaving was a mistake, and I personally think that's why Mark disregarded him for so long. It's like he wanted to "make it" just like MK, and MK never wanted it. The problem with brothers is that you are either forever together like Phil and Tommy Emmanuel, or forever apart. And even Phil and Tommy made different things together, Phil would always play solos and Tommy played rhythm, and the fact that Tommy is way more successful and famous never made their relationships go stale.
And instead of going through DS together with his brother and enjoying life now like John, David make records by selling guitars his brother played on. That's ridiculous indeed! But everybody pays to play.
I don't believe that David would play at high level like during the LOG tour, for example. He is much more a enthusiast than a player. So, he made his own thing.
About his personal life, i think very strange the way that he, sometimes, is very harsh with some DS/MK fan and sometimes he looks to his past with passion and desiring to play with Mark one more time. If when he is not selling some guitars around the web.
Good example about Tommy and Phil.
Tommy is a master and there was no competition between these two.
In case of DK, i think that existed an imaginary competition between him and his big brother. (in his head, of course)
On stage, David is very shy.
He don't know his own lyrics, he never got a real band...
His long time partner Harry Bognadovs is not quite a great player.
David sells his guitar/voice concerts because that is his only way to make money.
David is also politically active, something that Mark has always avoided. He can be quite rude to people who disagree with his political view which doesn’t tend to help someone in that kind of position.
Agreed!
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"He don't know his own lyrics"
Screen with texts?
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"He don't know his own lyrics"
Screen with texts?
Paper! ;D
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I always wondered myself what would had happened if MK would had been more open to others contributions, in the sense of allow one song ot two by David or John even for b-sides of singles. Their songs are good, not excellent as Mark's, but good in their own way, and I'm sure that arranged by the whole band, with MK guitar, it would had worked.
Take "Bernadette" for example, a song by David, which is not excellent but it's good on its own way, with the rythmic by John and Pick, and with MK guitar solo and lead guitar, the song sounds quite well, and as a b-side for any song it would had worked, even it would had fit in any DS record. It would had been less good than the rest, but every album has some excellent songs, and some others that are less good, but good on their way.
Also thinks that "Sacred loving" was on the demo of the band. Think in a band that has very little money, and they expend the one they have (from a money that John inherid) recording five songs, between them, one by David. If it wasn't good enough, why spend time and money recording a song by him, instead of doing just four MK songs? That sonng was different from the others but had an excellent work by John and Pick, and also an excellent guitar work by MK, so it would had fitm as minimum, in a b-side.
I'm one of David's patrons on patreon, and in one of his podcasts he said that first thing he did when left NY (and the band) and arrived to London was buy a house for himself, and buy a piano, and started playing things, and one of the first things he came with was the piano melodies that starts his song "Soul Kissing". In that podcast he played on the piano that melodies and first thing I thought was "that would had fit very well in a DS records with the help of MK guitar arrangements". His piano skills are far from the ones by Alan Clark, for example, but would had added something extra to the band.
Funnily, John Illsley played bass on that song, and he's on the videoclip as well, a quite bizarre videoclip in my opinion
https://youtu.be/4BwSPd5BFu0?t=157
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nicely spotted, Julio.
I think some DK songs would fit in DS records or B-Sides as well. Even in singles would be nice do hear some DK songs.
My dear friend Brunno Nunes said to me that DS rehearsed Southside Tenements between, 1977. I don't imagine this song in the first DS album.
In other hand, i believe that Bernardette easely would fit in the Communiqué album.
I believe that Maddona's Daughter would be part of the Making Movies album if David not quited the band. This song is cleary a dire Straits type of song.
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This discussion once again makes me dream of a world where Dire Straits doesn't exist and the Knopfler brothers are two separate solo artists.
I think that would be strange for Mark to sing David's songs and he didn't want to transform Dire Straits into multiple singers band because the composer should sing his song, like "Bernadette". And having more David songs that would be inevitable. I think giving this opportunity to sing a couple of his brother's songs was merely a "present" to David or MK trying to cheer him up a bit. Didn't last for long though, as history shows, and the songs didn't end up on any of the records anyway.
Or imagine there was no Dire Straits at all and it's all Mark Knopfler solo from the start, and all of the sudden somebody else steps in mid-show and sing his songs instead of MK. Feels strange? Because it is.
I can't imagine the situation where free contribution and democracy would work in Dire Straits because that was pretty much MK solo project from day one.
MK's songwriting, singing and guitar playing was always superior to David's, no wonder he refused to give him more space, especially since Mark wrote enough songs. More than that, guitar parts became harder to play and David struggled to follow even that, so his departure is as natural as any departure can be. John's story about it in his book made it especially clear.
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I don't think David struggled to play guitar really, there is a demo of Solid rock with David that sounds perfect to me, also Les Boys was played live with David, even Twisting by the pool, and all were OK. The problem is not he was struggling, but losing interest, losing feeling part of the band, losing the illusion. He was just fading, he was just don't mind about anything.
I remember that Bicknell said in an interview that the first time they played Tunnel for him was in Woodwharf, and it was spectacular, like they were playing for a stadium full of people. And it was David on second guitar at that occasion.
He wasn't as good as MK on guitar, obviously, but apparently he was enough for a second guitarist, except he didn't want to be that. He lost interest and wasn't able to play as it was expected because of that.
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I always wondered myself what would had happened if MK would had been more open to others contributions, in the sense of allow one song ot two by David or John even for b-sides of singles. Their songs are good, not excellent as Mark's, but good in their own way, and I'm sure that arranged by the whole band, with MK guitar, it would had worked.
Take "Bernadette" for example, a song by David, which is not excellent but it's good on its own way, with the rythmic by John and Pick, and with MK guitar solo and lead guitar, the song sounds quite well, and as a b-side for any song it would had worked, even it would had fit in any DS record. It would had been less good than the rest, but every album has some excellent songs, and some others that are less good, but good on their way.
Also thinks that "Sacred loving" was on the demo of the band. Think in a band that has very little money, and they expend the one they have (from a money that John inherid) recording five songs, between them, one by David. If it wasn't good enough, why spend time and money recording a song by him, instead of doing just four MK songs? That sonng was different from the others but had an excellent work by John and Pick, and also an excellent guitar work by MK, so it would had fitm as minimum, in a b-side.
I'm one of David's patrons on patreon, and in one of his podcasts he said that first thing he did when left NY (and the band) and arrived to London was buy a house for himself, and buy a piano, and started playing things, and one of the first things he came with was the piano melodies that starts his song "Soul Kissing". In that podcast he played on the piano that melodies and first thing I thought was "that would had fit very well in a DS records with the help of MK guitar arrangements". His piano skills are far from the ones by Alan Clark, for example, but would had added something extra to the band.
Funnily, John Illsley played bass on that song, and he's on the videoclip as well, a quite bizarre videoclip in my opinion
https://youtu.be/4BwSPd5BFu0?t=157
Why bizarre jbaent ?
Its just amateurish right ? :)
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the composer should sing his song
it's not always the case : Pete Townshend, Bob Robertson, Roger Waters, Brian Wilson for example were the main writers/composers in their bands but not always lead singers
Even some Brian May's songs are sung by Freddie Mercury (Prophet's song, Tie your mother down, we will rock you...) while he sings mayn of his songs
even Ringo sung songs written by Paul and/or John ;D
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Your correct, but in Mark's case, I believe he is the best singer for his songs.
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Your correct, but in Mark's case, I believe he is the best singer for his songs.
Absolutely!
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Your correct, but in Mark's case, I believe he is the best singer for his songs.
totally agree, but I was thinking of him singing David's or John's songs, as the subject was to imagine if John's & David's songs could have been released on DS albums.
another example : John Deacon wrote several Queen's hits (you' re my best friend, another one bites the dust, I want to break free...) but never sung one
so we could imagine Mark being the lead singer, but not the only one composer in the band. I guess it was Jbaent's suggestion :think
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Your correct, but in Mark's case, I believe he is the best singer for his songs.
totally agree, but I was thinking of him singing David's or John's songs, as the subject was to imagine if John's & David's songs could have been released on DS albums.
another example : John Deacon wrote several Queen's hits (you' re my best friend, another one bites the dust, I want to break free...) but never sung one
so we could imagine Mark being the lead singer, but not the only one composer in the band. I guess it was Jbaent's suggestion :think
Absolutely, and what I meant was it's not in every case the composer should sing his song, but rather in Mark's band that has to be that way since I doubt he would sing one of David's or John's songs himself.
I think the only way some of their songs may have ended up on the record is if MK would struggle to write enough new material, and the guy seems to experience no writing block at all in his whole career.
MK is not the only one to be so "selfish" about it, I think. Many people just love when on their album there's a line "All songs written by John Doe". That means the album is really your little masterpiece.
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Your correct, but in Mark's case, I believe he is the best singer for his songs.
totally agree, but I was thinking of him singing David's or John's songs, as the subject was to imagine if John's & David's songs could have been released on DS albums.
another example : John Deacon wrote several Queen's hits (you' re my best friend, another one bites the dust, I want to break free...) but never sung one
so we could imagine Mark being the lead singer, but not the only one composer in the band. I guess it was Jbaent's suggestion :think
MK is not the only one to be so "selfish" about it, I think. Many people just love when on their album there's a line "All songs written by John Doe". That means the album is really your little masterpiece.
I always think of “you got to have something” on this subject. How it isn’t credited to the writer of Rollin’ and Tumblin’ is beyond me!