A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: primi on April 18, 2022, 12:22:40 AM
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AP7ZK4KXULM
Guys, not sure if it was mentioned somewhere else, but I looked and found nothing. I'm a simple man, I see Knopfler mentioned and I click. :wave
But in the history of poorly thought out videos this one is pretty high up on the rank! What were they thinking? :o
OK, with my limited knowledge of signal chains a compressor is certainly something MK would use, but then they go and play.... Romeo and Juliet? What? Of all the songs they could have picked they go for the one that is played on a resonator? Great stuff.
Then BIA with another pedal to get some overdrive. Good idea but wait, what is Dave actually playing? I know BIA inside out and there are hardly 3 notes played right.
I think I stopped there. You've been warned. ;D
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I love Andertons, though even brilliant shops and channels like Andertons are baffled by the complexity of MK's music. It's funny how he plays Brothers In Arms on a Strat having a Les Paul by his side lol. I remember a video where Mark played a snippet of BIA on a Strat and said something like "that's rubbish". The song needs humbuckers!
Generally speaking, people are pretty good when it comes to emulating single-note soloing because not so much could be messed up there (like playing on a trumpet), but for more complex stuff, oh my gosh... People go all over the place.
Honestly, when it comes to MK's music, in all my life I never thought even a second about gear at all. Guitars? Yes, I thought about different guitars, but no other gear. I still don't know what pedals, amps, and effects he would use. A volume pedal? What I was interested in from day 1 is how he plays, not what.
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I’m a huge fan of the channel and Dave is a lovely guy and a great guitarist. Re the episode I think he struggled a lot trying to emulate Mark, which was expected given our man’s uniqueness.
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
With that said, almost any player has his own "tip of the iceberg" traits. Buy yourself a Brian May guitar, play with a coin and a treble booster, and boom — you sound just like Brian May! There are ways to build rigs to sound like David Gilmour, Hank Marvin, you name it. Signature instruments only add to this mess. Instead of being an affordable version of a guitar from your hero, it transformed into "the easiest way to get this sound". And for a lot of money too!
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Well, I must admit I did not watch the whole thing this time... I like the basic idea but think they ended up pressing on and off on a number of pedals rather than really digging for tone, and I agree that if you have to do this stuff and care about the colour of the guitar, you should also care about the type of guitar.
I like both Andertons and Dave. I must admit, however, that Andertons' demo videos have gotten somewhat predictable to me. It seems everything sounds really good in their videos no matter what they are trying out. While that is interesting in and of itself, there is a limit to the number of times it is interesting to see it. But I have learned quite a lot from watching so if I come up sounding a bit too negative the blame is on me.
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Well, I must admit I did not watch the whole thing this time... I like the basic idea but think they ended up pressing on and off on a number of pedals rather than really digging for tone, and I agree that if you have to do this stuff and care about the colour of the guitar, you should also care about the type of guitar.
I like both Andertons and Dave. I must admit, however, that Andertons' demo videos have gotten somewhat predictable to me. It seems everything sounds really good in their videos no matter what they are trying out. While that is interesting in and of itself, there is a limit to the number of times it is interesting to see it. But I have learned quite a lot from watching so if I come up sounding a bit too negative the blame is on me.
Yeah, I know what you mean. I purchased some things after watching their videos, so they definitely know their stuff. But the thing you're talking about, I think, is that the best is often the enemy of the good. They record videos so perfectly and have such great players that there is basically no point in gear and instruments — everything will sound great.
It's like Greg Koch reviewing any guitar for Wildwood Guitars, the guy can make even the shittiest guitar sound like Martin D-45. Can't say it's not fun watching them, but extremely "predictable", a good word for that, just like you've said.
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I love Andertons, though even brilliant shops and channels like Andertons are baffled by the complexity of MK's music. It's funny how he plays Brothers In Arms on a Strat having a Les Paul by his side lol. I remember a video where Mark played a snippet of BIA on a Strat and said something like "that's rubbish". The song needs humbuckers!
on may 8th 1985 in Montreux, DS played a playback of the song (only vocals live), and Mark mimmed BIA on the schecter strat !
https://youtu.be/_ljU_ADSFLY
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I love Andertons, though even brilliant shops and channels like Andertons are baffled by the complexity of MK's music. It's funny how he plays Brothers In Arms on a Strat having a Les Paul by his side lol. I remember a video where Mark played a snippet of BIA on a Strat and said something like "that's rubbish". The song needs humbuckers!
on may 8th 1985 in Montreux, DS played a playback of the song (only vocals live), and Mark mimmed BIA on the schecter strat !
https://youtu.be/_ljU_ADSFLY
Now that's hilarious! I love deliberate trolling like that, reminds me of the legendary video "Epic Guitar Solo":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sua_UaUNacY
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Great video with the "Epic Guitar Solo". If he managed to fool anyone, I would say they somehow deserved it. :)
Here is a guy who made a fool of himself trying to fool others: Go to 0:35 (and yes, the voice belongs to Roger Waters who is not singing, when his voice is heard which seems strange at a "live" concert:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ag4qB3vs-jA
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The fact is, only Mark Knopfler can be Mark Knopfler!!
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The fact is, only Mark Knopfler can be Mark Knopfler!!
But what about his namesakes??
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The fact is, only Mark Knopfler can be Mark Knopfler!!
But what about his namesakes??
Then they can make prank calls like no one else can.
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I love Andertons, though even brilliant shops and channels like Andertons are baffled by the complexity of MK's music. It's funny how he plays Brothers In Arms on a Strat having a Les Paul by his side lol. I remember a video where Mark played a snippet of BIA on a Strat and said something like "that's rubbish". The song needs humbuckers!
on may 8th 1985 in Montreux, DS played a playback of the song (only vocals live), and Mark mimmed BIA on the schecter strat !
https://youtu.be/_ljU_ADSFLY
Now that's hilarious! I love deliberate trolling like that, reminds me of the legendary video "Epic Guitar Solo":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sua_UaUNacY
ah ah great !
here is a video clip by a french band "Telephone" : "le jour s'est levé"
The lead guitarist Louis Bertignac mimms his electric solo on a... national guitar ! ;D ;D (but not exactly the same model as Mark's one)
https://youtu.be/ogb2dJEVds8
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
With that said, almost any player has his own "tip of the iceberg" traits. Buy yourself a Brian May guitar, play with a coin and a treble booster, and boom — you sound just like Brian May! There are ways to build rigs to sound like David Gilmour, Hank Marvin, you name it. Signature instruments only add to this mess. Instead of being an affordable version of a guitar from your hero, it transformed into "the easiest way to get this sound". And for a lot of money too!
I've never heard anyone nail the Hank Marvin sound... even MK!
It's in the "whammy bar" use I think, he goes really heavy on it.
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I've never heard anyone nail the Hank Marvin sound... even MK!
It's in the "whammy bar" use I think, he goes really heavy on it.
Hank is absolutely unbelievable... Every time I hear him I think about how simple the melody is and what magnitude of a master you need to be in order to play it so perfectly. Simple doesn't mean primitive. Sound-wise, yes, the whammy bar really shows who is who, it's not even about how heavy you go with it, just how tasteful it sounds. Hank does it perfectly every time. Mark has a great sound with a whammy bar, his own thing. But Mr. Marvin... oh my gosh!
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
That's interesting. I always liked more either neck pickup alone or neck and middle. To me, middle and bridge is too nasal, though it really captures the famous MK feel. Neck and middle gives a more rounded, full and bassy sound which I love.
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
The studio version is position four? Never heard of it…
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
The studio version is position four? Never heard of it…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eeaq3IK3txg
After having a listen to the isolated guitar track, I'm not sure, I don't think it's middle and bridge pickups to be honest. I never was into too much technicality anyway, and I always admire people who really dig this and even play different parts with different settings like, famously, in the "Single Handed Sailor". Despite all the controversy, I still think "it's in fingers", though I'd like to add "it's in the head".
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
The studio version is position four? Never heard of it…
of course we will never be sure...
BUT :
https://www.mk-guitar.com/2013/09/30/new-theory-on-the-sultans-of-swing-sound-dimarzio-fs-1-pickup-in-the-middle-position/
and :
https://www.mk-guitar.com/2010/09/16/trying-to-recreate-that-sultans-of-swing-sound-the-gear-i-used-on-the-puresolo-competition/
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I've seen many of those episodes, that's why I was so shocked by this amateurism. They didn't have to go for the 3 string vibrato, but BIA is not such a difficult melody to cause much trouble for the seasoned musician. I had a go myself many moons ago and it would pass for BIA if you heard it. What Dave played just wouldn't if you did not know what he was trying to play. And I'm no guitar player, never took a lesson, all my notes are a matter of guessing...
I’m pretty sure Dave underestimated Mark’s playing in terms of complexity… when he realized how hard it was to emulate him he was probably a few minutes into the recording lol
Or maybe not... For many people "Knopfler sound" is really just this squeaky 4th position chicken picking licks on a Strat and a wah-wah on a Les Paul. That's Knopfler enough for you! And the audience seems to love it, so only a genuine die-hard will go "wait a minute" watching this episode.
Position 2 actually, bridge and middle
not always.
even the SOS studio version is NOT bridge and middle. rather likely neck and middle (as he did in 91-92 and 96)
The studio version is position four? Never heard of it…
I always assumed studio version of SOS was middle pickup?
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That's interesting. I always liked more either neck pickup alone or neck and middle. To me, middle and bridge is too nasal, though it really captures the famous MK feel. Neck and middle gives a more rounded, full and bassy sound which I love.
+1000 :thumbsup :thumbsup
I love neck+middle too.
it's more "hollow" I find, and it works better for arpeggios sound middle+bridge imho
very SRV-Hendrix-Mayer... touch
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I always assumed studio version of SOS was middle pickup?
I touht that too during years
but discussing with Ingo he said to me that middle pickup alone would have sounded harsher than what we hear
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Clapton is known for using the middle pickup alone to achieve his famous woman tone. Don’t wanna sound authoritative here, please don’t get me wrong, but I’m almost 100% sure it was position 2 in the original recording and pretty much every time he played it with a strat. In the early years he’d switch to position 5 for the solos sometimes though. Regarding the Pensa era I think the original MK1 didn’t have coil splitting for the bridge so that would explain him avoiding position 2.
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Clapton is known for using the middle pickup alone to achieve his famous woman tone. Don’t wanna sound authoritative here, please don’t get me wrong, but I’m almost 100% sure it was position 2 in the original recording and pretty much every time he played it with a strat. In the early years he’d switch to position 5 for the solos sometimes though. Regarding the Pensa era I think the original MK1 didn’t have coil splitting for the bridge so that would explain him avoiding position 2.
to my ears, the studio version of sultans sounds different than every live version of the same era.
even the single version sounds different
I bet single version is middle+bridge, while album version is neck+bridge with that FS-1 PU in middle, like Ingo revealed by testing different combinations
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Clapton is known for using the middle pickup alone to achieve his famous woman tone. Don’t wanna sound authoritative here, please don’t get me wrong, but I’m almost 100% sure it was position 2 in the original recording and pretty much every time he played it with a strat. In the early years he’d switch to position 5 for the solos sometimes though. Regarding the Pensa era I think the original MK1 didn’t have coil splitting for the bridge so that would explain him avoiding position 2.
to my ears, the studio version of sultans sounds different than every live version of the same era.
even the single version sounds different
I bet single version is middle+bridge, while album version is neck+bridge with that FS-1 PU in middle, like Ingo revealed by testing different combinations
Well, it can be caused by a number of variables, especially different amps and new set of pickups. I have three Strats with the traditional configuration and they all sound very very different.