A Mark In Time
Mark Knopfler Discussion => Mark Knopfler Discussion Forum => Topic started by: singv on March 17, 2015, 04:07:28 PM
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http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jesse-kornbluth/talking-with-mark-knopfle_b_6864416.html
Very complimentary...nice one
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Cool that he got asked about cancelling Russian shows. People there still can't understand this gesture of Mark. But he seems like still in proud of it.
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He couldn't go into any country anymore, maybe with the exception of Bhutan?! All nations have (had?!) their fair share of disgusting cruelties, injustice and despotism. To me, his decision not to visit Russia was wrong.
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He couldn't go into any country anymore, maybe with the exception of Bhutan?! All nations have (had?!) their fair share of disgusting cruelties, injustice and despotism. To me, his decision not to visit Russia was wrong.
Yeah right. At the same time he have USA and German tours as we all know, and that's the point? And I actually read what Amnesty International supported terrorists once, so maybe I should consider boycotting Mark's music from listening then? Or maybe I should just listen to music, and Mark should play concerts what was announced?
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He couldn't go into any country anymore, maybe with the exception of Bhutan?! All nations have (had?!) their fair share of disgusting cruelties, injustice and despotism. To me, his decision not to visit Russia was wrong.
Yeah right. At the same time he have USA and German tours as we all know, and that's the point? And I actually read what Amnesty International supported terrorists once, so maybe I should consider boycotting Mark's music from listening then? Or maybe I should just listen to music, and Mark should play concerts what was announced?
I'd like to know which terrorist groups Amnesty supported haha!!!!!
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He couldn't go into any country anymore, maybe with the exception of Bhutan?! All nations have (had?!) their fair share of disgusting cruelties, injustice and despotism. To me, his decision not to visit Russia was wrong.
Yeah right. At the same time he have USA and German tours as we all know, and that's the point? And I actually read what Amnesty International supported terrorists once, so maybe I should consider boycotting Mark's music from listening then? Or maybe I should just listen to music, and Mark should play concerts what was announced?
I'd like to know which terrorist groups Amnesty supported haha!!!!!
I laugh just like you when read about Mark discussing Russia, as if he lives there. He knows only what he can read, just like I reading about Amnesty supporting terrorists. It's not the point, point is what Mark separates music from business, but for some reason music and politics are the same for him.
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He couldn't go into any country anymore, maybe with the exception of Bhutan?! All nations have (had?!) their fair share of disgusting cruelties, injustice and despotism. To me, his decision not to visit Russia was wrong.
Yeah right. At the same time he have USA and German tours as we all know, and that's the point? And I actually read what Amnesty International supported terrorists once, so maybe I should consider boycotting Mark's music from listening then? Or maybe I should just listen to music, and Mark should play concerts what was announced?
I'd like to know which terrorist groups Amnesty supported haha!!!!!
I laugh just like you when read about Mark discussing Russia, as if he lives there. He knows only what he can read, just like I reading about Amnesty supporting terrorists. It's not the point, point is what Mark separates music from business, but for some reason music and politics are the same for him.
I think he was upset cos a girl band was chucked in jail for singing in a church. If it had happened in UK, the cops would have removed them and let em go or not even have responded at all.
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I think he was upset cos a girl band was chucked in jail for singing in a church. If it had happened in UK, the cops would have removed them and let em go or not even have responded at all.
And here starts part nor Mark or general public don't know. Those girls are actually experienced troublemakers, they did not only singing in church, one of them once had s*x somewhere in public, while being prengant, they had another bad 'concert activity', this singing in church was just a last drop. Not talking about their music being pure dog's food, they're punks in the most disgusting meaning of the term.
And what Mark reads? 'Three poor Russian girls being thrown into jail for 2 years!'. And thinks 'I'm gonna cancel the tour over there'.
He cancel the tour in Russia because he admires girls who had s*x in public while pregnant or something like that? He should know the whole story first.
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And that was just two of their glorious public acts. I can go on and on. And by the way, they left the jail very soon after. Nobody sitted there 2 years.
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If Mark decided to cancel Russia it was done with strong reason for him to do so.
And since, new russian homophobian laws has proven him he was right.
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If Mark decided to cancel Russia it was done with strong reason for him to do so.
And since, new russian homophobian laws has proven him he was right.
Of course all other countries have 100% legal, good laws, no troubles of any king, good people, absence of gays on his concert, pure Shangri-La.
I'm actually WAS on the Mark's side all these two years, but after that interview I feel myself just pissed off. Long reaction, but still, I feel upset now.
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And that was just two of their glorious public acts. I can go on and on. And by the way, they left the jail very soon after. Nobody sitted there 2 years.
February 26,2012
December 23, 2013 upon a general amnesty.
Not exactly two years but still close.
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If Mark decided to cancel Russia it was done with strong reason for him to do so.
And since, new russian homophobian laws has proven him he was right.
Of course all other countries have 100% legal, good laws, no troubles of any king, good people, absence of gays on his concert, pure Shangri-La.
I'm actually WAS on the Mark's side all these two years, but after that interview I feel myself just pissed off. Long reaction, but still, I feel upset now.
Every country has democracy problem, even mine. But this is not all white nor all black, just that from a point you reach dark grey you have just to say STOP!
Especially when it is done on so called "moral" reason. The worst crimes are made on that name.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Amnesty_International
Even whole page for AI criticism exists on Wikipedia, I didn't know that. And after reading this, still you thinks AI filled with nuns and monks only?
But again, I talk here not about Amnesty International, I talk about fans who was hurt by his decision. In fact the only thing ended up hurt was fans.
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I think he was upset cos a girl band was chucked in jail for singing in a church. If it had happened in UK, the cops would have removed them and let em go or not even have responded at all.
And here starts part nor Mark or general public don't know. Those girls are actually experienced troublemakers, they did not only singing in church, one of them once had s*x somewhere in public, while being prengant, they had another bad 'concert activity', this singing in church was just a last drop. Not talking about their music being pure dog's food, they're punks in the most disgusting meaning of the term.
And what Mark reads? 'Three poor Russian girls being thrown into jail for 2 years!'. And thinks 'I'm gonna cancel the tour over there'.
He cancel the tour in Russia because he admires girls who had s*x in public while pregnant or something like that? He should know the whole story first.
Its not a crime to have sex in public in UK. Bad behaviour yes but we dont face jail. You ve got it wrong. You re 50 years behind.
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Thanks, I love Britain, too. Easy to talk when Mark can't cancel show in your country and swap it with another The Netherlands one prior to tour start.
You British people just have this prejudiced attitude on Russians, I've read couple of books about this topic already. French people loves Russians more, even German people loves Russians more despite WWI, WWII and 1812 wars. This is just facts. I must get on with it, and I'll do of course.
Just sad that 2008 concert was the last time I've seen Mark live in my hometown.
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Even Guy's diaries contains more disaffection and bad details about Russia than from other countries. Look at this car with a bath on the roof! Look at this poster! Look at this whore-looking girls! Look at this soldiers! Look at this police car! Mark said “The driving is a bit Dodge City” about Saint-Petersburg. Bad roads also got mentioned, also not very good airport and service. In other words, all bad in Russia if you're British.
I mean, why even bother to visit us in 2001, 2005 and 2008 then? Say you don't like Russia and don't be hypocritical. But 'official reason' was found.
Next time you will want to say a bad thing about Russia please consider we lost more souls in one of the first battles of WWII than UK in whole WWI.
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Yes Russia lost 20 million in WW2. But its NOW we re talking about. You are living in the middle ages for Gods sake.
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Foma, for me there are just two sides. It is difficult to discuss it here because it is a political discussion which would last at least hours maybe days to discuss it properly. I think the topic is really difficult. Of course it is a tragedy for Russian fans and it is a tragedy for you, and i feel really compassion about it.
On the other hand i think an artist as Mark Knopfler must be very wary what he does and what he does not. And i'm glad that he thinks about it and that he dares to declare himself (regardless whether his decision is right or wrong) Politians always try to misuse the glory of famous persons for their own reputation. I don't have an inside view into the Russian system, i only know some Russians who are living nearby, i like them and i even work together with them. They have all a different view to Russians politics, and so do we.
At the moment there is the military conflict in Ukraine where Russia is involved strongly and where also western countries (Putin thinks the Nato, probably he is right, don't know it) are involved. There is a propaganda war on both sides, so nobody can be sure what is right and what is wrong. So nobody here can make a decision that is based on logic and ratio because everwhere are only lies. So for this tour i can somehow understand that he is not playing in Russia. The situation is complete unclear, although the everydays life in Moscow is as ever.
The other thing is that from the view of many European countries (we are talking here about the majority of the inhabitants and not about all of them, there are also many inhabitants who have another opinion) Putins politics and how he is orientied has worrying signs. And the main question is does the Russian system really guarantee the values of a democracy. Western point is that Putin is loosing these values and is changing the direction, in Russia, however, he is very popular. There were huge (really HUGE) political changes in the last three decades in Russia. At this decisive point it is very important what is going to happen in the Future. Mark made a sign that he is for democracy, for separation of powers, for liberty of speech and freedom of expression. And he criticised that the Russian state didn't care about some of this values. He made clear that he is against Putins politic and he tried to make in that situation a sign. I like that sign, i'm very sad for you, because you are a big enthusiast, and indeed it's sad for a thousand of fans, but he has the right to do so (As you would have the right to boycott his concerts!). I like the Russian mentality here, and there is much understanding, but i think its good to make signs. And unfortunately there is not a clear division between arts and politis. Better he made that sign (even if it could be wrong) than supporting the possible wrong side.
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I think yontwocrows made a good point here. Every change in history is made by revolution, one way or the other. Pussy Riot made statements their way. They want more freedom and you can agree or disagree with the way they did it. But it was their revolution to make it clear. In the Western world we are used to freedom and are very liberal towards people who fight for their freedom of speech, expression, behaviour. I am heterosexual, but I really can't understand that there are still people in this world who think it's a disease or who think they can change it by punishing. That's why we can understand and agree with the decision MK made.
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Can't comment on the politics :thumbsdown I don't know enough about it to be objective.
Can Comment on the Huffing Posts review though. :thumbsup
Also their choice of an AMIT video for the story! :clap :thumbsup
WARNING re: this topic.
Don't get too fired-up.
Politics can do that!
And AMIT can do with-out it!!
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Sorry, you're right it goes off-topic. Foma, if you want, we can discuss it in another non MK related thread. I won't fired up with the topic, Shangri-La, and i respect foma a lot, and can understand his point of view very well. Thanks for warning
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Leaving the forum last night for a good night's sleep, I already knew what I would read here today: Now those figures of WW1 and WW2 are showing up again - foma, I am sorry that you lost your lighthearted, friendly temper that you showed on AMIT and got so angry about this. We already lost Ustas two years ago because of this - so it is a very delicate theme, no doubt.
As this is a Mark Knopfler orientated forum, we should concentrate on Mark and DS and his music and guitars AND tabs. And yes, also on his decisions of course. But bringing up WW2 figures, Amnesty/terrorist matters and stuff will lead too far into other themes like politics, religion, s.e.xuality (hehe), economy and stuff, and we just can't do it - not because we are just a bunch of uncritical fanboys (and -girls) but because it will blow up the AMIT idea from my point of view. Same as I am not a friend of f.e. posting political stuff on fb, as it is just a social network, not more, and not a platform for everything under the sun.
So maybe you can come over it and look at this as something that is done and cannot be re-done. If Mark has done a wrong decision, so ok, he's human after all. If you cannot come over it, try to weigh up if your love and compassion for Mark is affected by this decision so strongly that you can still listen to him and his music or not. I would love you to listen to him in the future furthermore, be assured.
I can add that he never played in my hometown so I had to travel everytime I wanted to see him. ;)
LE
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please keep this forum free from politics
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Yes agreed, MK 'positiveness' only thankyou...... :clap
Great interview I thought....
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Thank you all, I said already I must go along with it. I just think that, if only thing what got hurt is fans, why won't you protest after the concert? Or ON it? Madonna played concert in 2013 in the shirt with 'Free Pussy Riot' written on it if I remember correctly. This is kind of 'protest' I can understand.
Mark is almost unknown there, especially in our numb post-soviet government. So his decision is like me boycotting his music — patently absurd.
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Foma,
Sometimes you just have to 'move on' from things at the end of the day.
Just remember like us, MK will not be around forever so make the most of him while you can....
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Foma,
Sometimes you just have to 'move on' from things at the end of the day.
Just remember like us, MK will not be around forever so make the most of him while you can....
Sorry Steve, but I feel myself like in mental hospital here on AMIT. With me as a patient and others as doctors.
So nothing wrong with Ustas on that side, I can clearly understand him. Let's see if I can stand this medieval attacks and total intolerance.
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Foma,
I find it a real shame espeically on this fabulous forum that Politics or simular have to come in the way of us all appreciating a true master in MK....
Personally I feel we all have our differences in life, and I respect that but this should NOT come in the way of following the great master...
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Foma,
Sometimes you just have to 'move on' from things at the end of the day.
Just remember like us, MK will not be around forever so make the most of him while you can....
Sorry Steve, but I feel myself like in mental hospital here on AMIT. With me as a patient and others as doctors.
So nothing wrong with Ustas on that side, I can clearly understand him. Let's see if I can stand this medieval attacks and total intolerance.
Totally with you on this Foma and think Mark was wrong in his decision. Only his fans suffered. Did that never occur to him or did he really cancel the shows for another reason, using Putin/AI as an excuse...
Back to the interview and I don't really like these ones where he's been interviewed because they tend to be non-critical. Therefore the actual review is pointless.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Amnesty_International
Even whole page for AI criticism exists on Wikipedia, I didn't know that. And after reading this, still you thinks AI filled with nuns and monks only?
But again, I talk here not about Amnesty International, I talk about fans who was hurt by his decision. In fact the only thing ended up hurt was fans.
No fan was physically hurt by Mark's cancelling decision.
Anna Politkovskaïa was shot dead.
Pussy riots were physically jailed.
Where is the moral?
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Foma,
Sometimes you just have to 'move on' from things at the end of the day.
Just remember like us, MK will not be around forever so make the most of him while you can....
Sorry Steve, but I feel myself like in mental hospital here on AMIT. With me as a patient and others as doctors.
So nothing wrong with Ustas on that side, I can clearly understand him. Let's see if I can stand this medieval attacks and total intolerance.
Totally with you on this Foma and think Mark was wrong in his decision. Only his fans suffered. Did that never occur to him or did he really cancel the shows for another reason, using Putin/AI as an excuse...
Back to the interview and I don't really like these ones where he's been interviewed because they tend to be non-critical. Therefore the actual review is pointless.
Oh Gawd!! Moving on....
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Amnesty_International
Even whole page for AI criticism exists on Wikipedia, I didn't know that. And after reading this, still you thinks AI filled with nuns and monks only?
But again, I talk here not about Amnesty International, I talk about fans who was hurt by his decision. In fact the only thing ended up hurt was fans.
No fan was physically hurt by Mark's cancelling decision.
Anna Politkovskaïa was shot dead.
Pussy riots were physically jailed.
Where is the moral?
The fans didn't do anything wrong and yet after paying money and looking forward to the concert suddenly found themselves having no concert to go to because Mark cancelled due to his beliefs. Yet he tours happily all the time in countries where their governments start wars despite writing anti-war songs. Bizarre! The government does not speak for his concert-goers but they get punished.
I think shangri la 1 was correct in that this is not a forum for politics. :)
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This forum is about Mark, Mark is a human being, human beings make decisions on daily basis, decisions may be good or bad, and may be political.
So all politics here in decision effect and all that remain actually worth talking about and nothing wrong here.
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Thank you dmg for your good inputs. At least somebody feel sorry for people, just music fans who was literally spit in face by Mark with this decision.
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We, couple of hundreds of fans, even wrote an open letter to Mark. But you know, you'll never get to The One if he doesn't want to.
So he just spit in faces of all those people, like Roger Waters. You can say there was too small reaction, but it's because we don't know English much.
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Thank you dmg for your good inputs. At least somebody feel sorry for people, just music fans who was literally spit in face by Mark with this decision.
Don't worry, dmg is not the only one: you have my sympathy too. And if I'm honest I find the decision of Mark completely out of place, on the substance and method
Only, I don't like to discuss politics in a music forum
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He did the same against the apartheid regime of South Africa in the 80's, so it's really nothing new for the man.
Although the banning was of course a two way street.
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He did the same against the apartheid regime of South Africa in the 80's, so it's really nothing new for the man.
Although the banning was of course a two way street.
Boy, you can compare... ;D
Yes, I saw many people who said 'I'll never listen to Mark's music again after that' or comments on the internet with links to the news and saying 'After this I will not listen to him'. I still stumble across that constantly. You obviously can say they're just fools and this have nothing to do with music. But... is cancelling shows have something to do with music, anyway? Mark is a politician or a musician? So, it's a two way street.
At least Dire Straits was really huge name in 80s and they ended up as headline act on Mandela' 'birthday party'.
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Politicians are not good people nowadays. In my point of view, good people can't be politician. In Turkey we have this Erdogan puppet. He is doing a lot of terrible things to his people. Just a fascist without any knowledge and kindness. BUT music fans should not be punished for it.
In 2013 we have Gezi Park protests with 3.5 millions of people, due to corruptions of this worthless man. Police brutally attacked the demonstrators and a couple of young man lost his life. Precisely in those days Roger Waters bring The Wall tour to the Istanbul and reflected on the wall photographs of those killed. Counting individual by name.That's what I call a protest.
Don't get me wrong, ? love this man's music but this does not ensure that the right of every decision. We say here music and politics diffrent thing - and i agree- but apparently our man do not feel the same way.
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Politicians are not good people nowadays. In my point of view, good people can't be politician. In Turkey we have this Erdogan puppet. He is doing a lot of terrible things to his people. Just a fascist without any knowledge and kindness. BUT music fans should not be punished for it.
In 2013 we have Gezi Park protests with 3.5 millions of people, due to corruptions of this worthless man. Police brutally attacked the demonstrators and a couple of young man lost his life. Precisely in those days Roger Waters bring The Wall tour to the Istanbul and reflected on the wall photographs of those killed. Counting individual by name.That's what I call a protest.
Don't get me wrong, ? love this man's music but this does not ensure that the right of every decision. We say here music and politics diffrent thing - and i agree- but apparently our man do not feel the same way.
You're right, we have a proverb here, which have Latin origins I believe, meaning 'Only fools can be hungry for any forms of authority'.
And what happen, we have fools in government, this is bad. But when we lost a favourite artist's show BECAUSE of the government is not bad, it's a ******* ********.
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He did the same against the apartheid regime of South Africa in the 80's, so it's really nothing new for the man.
Although the banning was of course a two way street.
Boy, you can compare... ;D
Yes, I saw many people who said 'I'll never listen to Mark's music again after that' or comments on the internet with links to the news and saying 'After this I will not listen to him'. I still stumble across that constantly. You obviously can say they're just fools and this have nothing to do with music. But... is cancelling shows have something to do with music, anyway? Mark is a politician or a musician? So, it's a two way street.
At least Dire Straits was really huge name in 80s and they ended up as headline act on Mandela' 'birthday party'.
No comparison made, promise! Although as a legal counsel I have a hard time understanding (from a strictly legal point of view) the anti-gay acts, which kind of seems a bit apartheid-ish these days... Les Boys did the cabaret already in the time of the Making Movies album.
I'd say MK is a musician first who besides that is a longtime member of Amnesty - not just for the good cause, but for his own determined opinions.
I really have no stance in the debate. Just wanted to drop a note regarding his previous ban.
Exiting :wave
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I hear what you re saying, but what MK is doing is nothing compared to Sting https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2009/11/is_sting_the_wo/
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I hear what you re saying, but what MK is doing is nothing compared to Sting https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2009/11/is_sting_the_wo/
Thank you for the link geordie_60! Well. That's was just disgusting. By the way, Sting was OK with Russia, he gave some big interviews, even recorded couple of songs for a Christmas TV special. Mark also gave this strange 'secret show' once in US bank right in the middle of the tour. I just hate these things. What's wrong with this people?
Why on Earth I caught myself thinking about throwing someone's records out of the window? I never thought that I actually CAN think like that, but I certainly do.
You'll never know what will happen tomorrow.
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If you look at some MK/DS timeline you'll see that some private shows have been performed through the years, not often but a few.
Mark is a professional artist, live gigs is part of his living, in that sense he is just hired to do his job. About the last couple of privates shows it seemed that it was really part of a deal supporting the tour. The Rover show well it was the company that drove mark all over its European tour. The US private gig was less obvious but from what I heard it was a way not to lose too much money on the short US tour.
Usually corporate gigs are not publicised so were are entitled not to know about it but hey this internet time and almost everybody (but me) owns a smartphone...
And even a few public shows in the recent years were ridiculously so high priced tix such as Monaco or Floriana.
That said, even for private shows, Mark wouldn't play for some people/corporates even if offered a bunch of dollars to do so.
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I disagreed with Mark's decision also. But I love him too much,
I would never throw away my cds or stop listening to him. :lol
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I disagreed with Mark's decision also. But I love him too much,
I would never throw away my cds or stop listening to him. :lol
Wait till' he'd cancel the whole US tour for a small reason and we will see ;)
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I disagreed with Mark's decision also. But I love him too much,
I would never throw away my cds or stop listening to him. :lol
I can understand that you're angry because I think he shouldn't mix political things with Music! He has afterall a lot of Fans in Russia!!!!! But I couldn't either throw away his CD's if he would decide to cancel his shows in France!! Lucky for us this year that we were not voting for the presidency because if the FN in France was winning he would surely do it!!
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I disagreed with Mark's decision also. But I love him too much,
I would never throw away my cds or stop listening to him. :lol
Wait till' he'd cancel the whole US tour for a small reason and we will see ;)
He could, death penalty - even for intellectually disabled people - would be a valid reason to ban USA from touring, or at least states that still do it...
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He could, death penalty - even for intellectually disabled people - would be a valid reason to ban USA from touring, or at least states that still do it...
Saw it today in my Facebook feed:
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-c-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xfp1/v/t1.0-9/10405674_10152676581406363_4860316437465750747_n.jpg?oh=8369d7d78fec101f565d95c3a11127df&oe=55B4FB5F&__gda__=1433639738_7f03e63b66a59a047b56094ed45311d3)
So where your super mighty powers, Mark? There's a death penalty in USA and you going to play there. You're bad guy! ;D ;D
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You can't put all things on the same level. Otherwise you end alone because there always something about protesting.
But, from a personal point of view, would be glad to hear and see Mark actively acting against death penalty.
So far Mark is still supporting AI and thus in a a way is protesting against that.
The human right's in Russia seems unfortunately quite worse than in the US. But we can hope that things will turn better there in the future, the question being how long.
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I think he was upset cos a girl band was chucked in jail for singing in a church. If it had happened in UK, the cops would have removed them and let em go or not even have responded at all.
And here starts part nor Mark or general public don't know. Those girls are actually experienced troublemakers, they did not only singing in church, one of them once had s*x somewhere in public, while being prengant, they had another bad 'concert activity', this singing in church was just a last drop. Not talking about their music being pure dog's food, they're punks in the most disgusting meaning of the term.
And what Mark reads? 'Three poor Russian girls being thrown into jail for 2 years!'. And thinks 'I'm gonna cancel the tour over there'.
He cancel the tour in Russia because he admires girls who had s*x in public while pregnant or something like that? He should know the whole story first.
foma, what is wrong with having s e x? in public? got more details on that? i mean, she did not shoot heroin in public, while being pregnant. pregnant people have s e x ual desires too.
also, what is wrong with being a punk, besides the fact that it may not suit your, or my lifestyle? each their own, i would say.
do not get me wrong, i am not here to get in a fight, i just wonder.
where did you get the information from? i may be naive, but how much of the media in russia is not somehow state controlled? if you disagree, name me one media outlet that is not controlled by the state. i know that RT is not one of them.
anyways, as you said, let us listen to the music, and mark make it, the rest is out of our hands.
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Sorry for bringing up this topic again, but I'm still angry. And I stopped listening Tracker for second day now, and I can't help it.
If Mark will say just one other proud word about cancelling Russian shows I'll throw all his records out of the window and will never listen it again.
I disagreed with Mark's decision also. But I love him too much,
I would never throw away my cds or stop listening to him. :lol
Wait till' he'd cancel the whole US tour for a small reason and we will see ;)
He could, death penalty - even for intellectually disabled people - would be a valid reason to ban USA from touring, or at least states that still do it...
or indiana, where, just like in russia, homophobic laws were just released. true, in the end there are so many places he could not go to....
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or indiana, where, just like in russia, homophobic laws were just released. true, in the end there are so many places he could not go to....
Unfortunately there no country with perfect democracy.
But unbelievable that in 2015 the USA can support this type of discrimination.
What's next step?
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or indiana, where, just like in russia, homophobic laws were just released. true, in the end there are so many places he could not go to....
Unfortunately there no country with perfect democracy.
But unbelievable that in 2015 the USA can support this type of discrimination.
What's next step?
the US also does indeed execute people with a proven mental handicap. go muricah...
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or indiana, where, just like in russia, homophobic laws were just released. true, in the end there are so many places he could not go to....
Unfortunately there no country with perfect democracy.
But unbelievable that in 2015 the USA can support this type of discrimination.
What's next step?
the US also does indeed execute people with a proven mental handicap. go muricah...
This is what I wrote a few page ago maybe without using the correct words (mentall handicap = intellectually disabled): "He could, death penalty - even for intellectually disabled people - would be a valid reason to ban USA from touring, or at least states that still do it..."
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In America most of these issues come down to religion. Same as many other problems we face worldwide.
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In America most of these issues come down to religion. Same as many other problems we face worldwide.
Agree 100%. Christian principles are great. Individual denominations interpretations and their own sense of ownership are the problem.
Fossil fuel reliance is the other problem world wide. Not just climate, but the wars that aren't based on religion are mostly based on the stuff that nature sequestered under the ground for us.
:think
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Guy confirmed today on his forum that, basically, Russia is the only troubled country in whole tour route. So apparently all the rest are totally liberal.
To me deliberate avoiding of specific country on whole tour is more human rights violation than things they are actually trying to fight with.
I'm afraid the tour is complete as announced. Apart from (the human rights violations) in Russia, current political situations have nothing to do with the tour routing.
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It isn't really a human right to have Mark Knopfler playing in your country, although I'd be pretty happy if that was the law. How sad I am for you that MK isn't going to play anywhere near you foma, I can understand his decision not to play with such homophobic laws. But that is entirely my opinion. On the other hand, like there's been said before; you can find a reason for any country.. Difficult. Anyway, maybe a good moment to go back to topic or make a new thread for this discussion?
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No need for a new thread unless Mark or Guy will say something bad about it again. They both looks so proud about it, and that's pathetic.
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That's because most people don't have the time or the nerve to scrutinise those predications declared by the mass media in lockstep. Now I'm being ironic: we are good and they are bad. Simple as that.
This is something, anybody should think about:
Every time I read an article about something where I know my stuff, I tend to discover errors and inaccuracies - sometimes even plain lies.
When I turn the page and read something different about things that I'm not experienced in and educated about, I always have to remind me that the text may have its errors, lies and inaccuracies too.
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IMO, canceling the Russian shows in 2013 was a major fault.
It's a question of loyalty towards the fans who had paid their tickets (and arranged plane tickets, booked hotels, planned days off or vacations...) and were looking forward to that moment.
At no point Mark or whoever in the band was threatened by homophobia or human rights question.
The only ones who paid the price are fans like foma. 20 Thousands of fans paid for a caprice.
What about Putin ? Since MK is not a judo champion or an ice skating beauty, Putin probably doesn't know who he is ! :think
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IMO, canceling the Russian shows in 2013 was a major fault.
It's a question of loyalty towards the fans who had paid their tickets (and arranged plane tickets, booked hotels, planned days off or vacations...) and were looking forward to that moment.
At no point Mark or whoever in the band was threatened by homophobia or human rights question.
The only ones who paid the price are fans like foma. 20 Thousands of fans paid for a caprice.
What about Putin ? Since MK is not a judo champion or an ice skating beauty, Putin probably doesn't know who he is ! :think
Thank you for a good point. Yes, at least he could release the statement AFTER the concert, it can be survived painlessly, or a lot easier anyway.
I know it would be very bad for him to play, because its the reason he canceled whole thing and so on, but I promise fans up to date didn't get it.
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Thank you for a good point. Yes, at least he could release the statement AFTER the concert, it can be survived painlessly, or a lot easier anyway.
I know it would be very bad for him to play, because its the reason he canceled whole thing and so on, but I promise fans up to date didn't get it.
It's really the way I feel it. It's a question of respect. 20,000 customers paid their tickets and have no plan B.
The strongest way to react would have been to play in Russia and deliver a message on stage.