Dream team

[dmg]

Well: Here is my go:

Pick is the best drummer MK's played with, Terry's the worst (but great fun and loud), Chad is better than Danny, but Guy likes Danny better (as a person and also as a player I believe), Jeff Porcaro was great, Money For Nothing is best with MK alone and Richie on cowbell, Glenn has never managed to play Money For Nothing or Brothers In Arms properly, Mel Collins is the best sax play MK has had on tour, but of course Michael Brecker is the best he has played with, Guy's music is a bit boring, and his playing too, JMcC is great!!! Matty is fantastic. DS stopped existing in 1982 and will of course never reunite, the ATTR tour was boring, the original pensa suhr sounds crap live (even on You and your friend) and MK will never play it anymore because of its slim neck and I guess also because of its BMG pu's, Mk's music will become slower and slower... if I want to listen to rock, I will put on Making Movies or som other band than DS or MK. And I really don't want to hurt anyone, these are just my opinions. I love you all (I really mean it!)
[/quote]
Some controversial stuff there to get us all going!  Well wasn't the original Pensa-Suhr black as played on the EC tour in 1987?  The flame maple MK II one you refer to had EMG pu's, not BMG ones.  Guy will never criticise Danny as he is a current band member and a friend, no matter what his opinion was anyway!
While we're being controversial, IMO MK's biggest mistake was changing to a finer gauge guitar string;  his guitars no longer have that lovely thick creamy sound but a slightly tinny sound.  This is especially noticeable on something like Speedway and Wild Theme is no longer playable properly;  it just sounds terrible to me.

[Mossguitar]

He, he, EMG's. The black came before the first carved flame maple, yes, but it's not an MK II (we've discussed this many times before), it's a Pensa Suhr custom strat shaped carved bodey blah, blah, blah. I think later production models are called MK I. And he's had at least one Pensa before the black one, namly the So Far Away one that controlled the synclavier.

I thought MK changed to heavyer strings, not to lighter ones, from 9's to 10's on the guitars for fingerpicking, but changed back to 9's on the sig strats right before the last tour. But I think he still uses 10's on his LPs and even heavier strings for the ones he plays with a pick (the jurassic strat, the sigs with trems etc). I know some fans that miss the time he played 8s (some believe that he played 8s on the first or first two records. Personally I think the reason that MK's tone has changed is due to the change of amps, from Comets to Reinhards.

[dmg]

He, he, EMG's. The black came before the first carved flame maple, yes, but it's not an MK II (we've discussed this many times before), it's a Pensa Suhr custom strat shaped carved bodey blah, blah, blah. I think later production models are called MK I. And he's had at least one Pensa before the black one, namly the So Far Away one that controlled the synclavier.

I thought MK changed to heavyer strings, not to lighter ones, from 9's to 10's on the guitars for fingerpicking, but changed back to 9's on the sig strats right before the last tour. But I think he still uses 10's on his LPs and even heavier strings for the ones he plays with a pick (the jurassic strat, the sigs with trems etc). I know some fans that miss the time he played 8s (some believe that he played 8s on the first or first two records. Personally I think the reason that MK's tone has changed is due to the change of amps, from Comets to Reinhards.

I'm sure I read on Guy's site that at the beginning of the KtGC tour MK changed to 9's (from 10's) on all his guitars.  Doesn't he change amps a lot though, I mean on every tour so...  I was aware of the change to Reinhardts but just dismissed this as it sounds more like a string thing if you know what I mean.
By the way how come MK and Guy are always praising the sound of older guitars (the older the better) yet MK uses his horribly artificial sounding Sig Strat extensively these days when he has beautiful older Strats he could use that sounded far better in the past.  He uses it in the studio too so it's not just for fear of damage or theft.  Hypocritical?

[Pottel]

wow, some very true points there, and some others def. up for discussion

[boboDS]

Pick is the best drummer MK's played with, Terry's the worst (but great fun and loud), Chad is better than Danny, but Guy likes Danny better (as a person and also as a player I believe), Jeff Porcaro was great, Money For Nothing is best with MK alone and Richie on cowbell, Glenn has never managed to play Money For Nothing or Brothers In Arms properly, Mel Collins is the best sax play MK has had on tour, but of course Michael Brecker is the best he has played with, Guy's music is a bit boring, and his playing too, JMcC is great!!! Matty is fantastic. DS stopped existing in 1982 and will of course never reunite, the ATTR tour was boring, the original pensa suhr sounds crap live (even on You and your friend) and MK will never play it anymore because of its slim neck and I guess also because of its BMG pu's, Mk's music will become slower and slower... if I want to listen to rock, I will put on Making Movies or som other band than DS or MK. And I really don't want to hurt anyone, these are just my opinions. I love you all (I really mean it!)

Interesting stuff you said, I think that you could say that DS stopped existing after 1978 as a band or even never existed, it was just a support band for MK, he just needed people to play other instruments. That;s it.

But I agree with some other parts (like ATTR tour was boring, also if I want to listen to rock &roll...that's why I don't much care for the K2GC or other solo stuff, I haven't even heard the latest album yet..)

Also agree with Mel Collins, because I just can't stand Two young lovers being played by CH.White (that's a skipper for me) or drums played by some else than TW on this song (and the ending solo by Ph. Palmer, terrrrrrible). I also don't like Sultans with Sax, why
why why.

As for the drummers, maybe Pick was technically the best, but that's it for me. He was ok in the early stages (78-79), but when DS evolved to more rock&rollish sound, he wasn't the man to do it. I think that Terry took the songs onto another level. They were full of energy, he enabled to develop the full dynamic potential of the songs, it was the best DS sound and era for me.

Chad is maybe technically better than DC, I think I prefer his sound. Both sound very good, but there's this one thing that makes the difference for me - Speedway, and these particular snare hits in the ending solo. DC almost doesn't hit the snare at all, I really miss it there.


As for the second guitarist, definitely not Ph. Palmer, maybe RB, but he just gives me this too laid-back impression. Jack Sonni or Hal Lindes would be my choices.

I would prefer A. Clark to G. Fletcher anytime, but if there are supposed to be 2 keyboard players, then it should be them.

What really got me hooked on DS was this "rock&roll" Alchemy sound, that was MK (and the others) at his best imho. So here's my dream team:

MK
JI
Terry Williams
Alan Clark
Hal Lindes (Jack sonni?)

Mel Collins
Guy Fletcher

[Mossguitar]

Hey, now we finally get some different opinions here! Nice!

I agree with most of what your saying, bobo. When it comes to DS as a band, the reason I'm saying that they stopped existing as a band in 81, is that I think (I don't know for sure, of course) that Pick and John influenced heavily on the sound of first two or maybe three records. The rhythm section was very distinct thanks to the base playing and the drumming. And they really were a band in the early years, more or less living together at first, rehearsing and touring a lot like a proper band. When the Making Movies tour ended, or maybe already during or before that tour, DS stopped beeing a band. From then on it was more MK solo with different session musicians. And no real DS sound exept for MK's unique guitar playning, of course. I think MK's current band is much more like a band than DS was on the tree last DS records and tours, since they doesn't change the lineup that much anymore and therefore they've got a certain sound again.

I really love MK's solo work, but since he doesn't make rock music anymore, I have to listen to other peoples music to be satisfied in that departement. But I always have listened to other music, so it's no problem that he doesn't make rock music anymore.

[boboDS]

Yes you're right, the same people create the same kind of feel, especially when there always were different band members after communique. I was looking at it from a different point of view - democratic/creative imput point...

But I always have listened to other music, so it's no problem that he doesn't make rock music anymore.

Well it's not a problem, but at the same it kinda is. But what can I one about it? I sometimes wonder how would it all looked like if MK continued to make albums in Love over Gold ablum style...

[jcser]

I am fiercely loyal to those I am fond of, and I will be loyal to Danny until I die. I love his energy, his obvious enjoyment of what he is doing, and on many renditions of Speedway, it's him I am watching...not the Man.

[localhero1986]

Hmm, I'm glad he doesn't make albums only in the style of LOG... It is a nice album, but listening to LOG, TR and PI too long, I might fall asleep. It sounds way too flat. (and please, no I'm not looking for trouble here!!! )

Concerning the guitars, I think he (and guy) can choose the best gear on the planet. Vintage stuff is cool, but when you don't get the "new" sound out if it, it's pretty useless. To be honest, I don't think it's all about an "old" sound, it's about "a" sound, which can be old or new.

[dmg]

Hmm, I'm glad he doesn't make albums only in the style of LOG... It is a nice album, but listening to LOG, TR and PI too long, I might fall asleep. It sounds way too flat. (and please, no I'm not looking for trouble here!!! )

Concerning the guitars, I think he (and guy) can choose the best gear on the planet. Vintage stuff is cool, but when you don't get the "new" sound out if it, it's pretty useless. To be honest, I don't think it's all about an "old" sound, it's about "a" sound, which can be old or new.

I understand what you're saying about the guitars there, but the fact is that MK has actually, in some cases changed to playing his sig model from an older one whilst on tour on the old songs.  One could take STP as an example - he used to use a lovely white Strat from the 60's for that on the STP tour but now he uses his sig model with that modern electronic sound.  Yuck!

[boboDS]

Hmm, I'm glad he doesn't make albums only in the style of LOG... It is a nice album, but listening to LOG, TR and PI too long, I might fall asleep. It sounds way too flat. (and please, no I'm not looking for trouble here!!! )

That's what I like about LoG, not 12 4-minute tracks, but long "fully developped" songs, the whole album with slight touch of art rock.

[dmg]

Hmm, I'm glad he doesn't make albums only in the style of LOG... It is a nice album, but listening to LOG, TR and PI too long, I might fall asleep. It sounds way too flat. (and please, no I'm not looking for trouble here!!! )

That's what I like about LoG, not 12 4-minute tracks, but long "fully developped" songs, the whole album with slight touch of art rock.

I kind of fall between both stools here in that I like an album to have perhaps one or two longer tracks and the rest made up of shorter ones.  To have them all long allows no development for live performances and all short is just all words and no intrumentation - you're just getting "into it" when it's finishing.  That's why I love STP and MM so much;  we have Speedway and TOL to satisfy our needs for "developed songs" and guitar solos then the rest wasn't so bad either!

[boboDS]

Interesting point. The thing I liked about DS was the awesome concert versions of the songs.
But on the other hand, after listening to concerts some of the songs sound like they were made in a hurry and kinda cut at the end. Hill Farmer's Blues or News could be an example of that.

So there should be at least three 9 min tracks on each album and the rest could be anything else. 

[dustyvalentino]

Well: Here is my go:

Pick is the best drummer MK's played with, Terry's the worst (but great fun and loud), Chad is better than Danny, but Guy likes Danny better (as a person and also as a player I believe), Jeff Porcaro was great, Money For Nothing is best with MK alone and Richie on cowbell, Glenn has never managed to play Money For Nothing or Brothers In Arms properly, Mel Collins is the best sax play MK has had on tour, but of course Michael Brecker is the best he has played with, Guy's music is a bit boring, and his playing too, JMcC is great!!! Matty is fantastic. DS stopped existing in 1982 and will of course never reunite, the ATTR tour was boring, the original pensa suhr sounds crap live (even on You and your friend) and MK will never play it anymore because of its slim neck and I guess also because of its BMG pu's, Mk's music will become slower and slower... if I want to listen to rock, I will put on Making Movies or som other band than DS or MK. And I really don't want to hurt anyone, these are just my opinions. I love you all (I really mean it!)

What a great post, even though I don't agree with all of it. Here's my take on each point:

Pick is the best drummer MK's played with, Probably 50-50 with Jeff Porcaro for me

Terry's the worst (but great fun and loud), No, Ed Bicknell would definitely be the worst

Chad is better than Danny, but Guy likes Danny better (as a person and also as a player I believe), Don't know about Guy, but agree that Chad is a better drummer than Danny

Jeff Porcaro was great, Agreed, RIP Jeff

Money For Nothing is best with MK alone and Richie on cowbell, Agreed, although even though the album version is my No1 all time favourite song of all time, I don't think it's EVER worked properly live

Glenn has never managed to play Money For Nothing or Brothers In Arms properly, Can't say I've ever noticed a problem, but I'll admit to not paying too much attention to Glenn's bass parts

Mel Collins is the best sax play MK has had on tour, but of course Michael Brecker is the best he has played with, Agree on Brecker (RIP), not so sure on Mel. To be honest I haven't paid too much attention to the sax playing either, but presumably Chris White composed the famous R&J solo and therefore deserves brownie points IMO

Guy's music is a bit boring, and his playing too, Don't know much about Guy's music, never got round to buying Inamorta. I guess his playing might be said to be a bit boring, but right or wrong he's a vital part of MK's "sound". In football terms, he's like the holding midfielder, unlikely to win many plaudits but vital to the team

JMcC is great!!! He is good, but I think people go over the top about him. I dunno, maybe it's because here in Scotland we have LOTS of top musicians who can play the fiddle/pipes etc really well. Seriously, you can go to a "celidh" here any night of the week and see amazing fiddle players, you'll see them busking in Edinburgh too

Matty is fantastic. Agreed, really nice bloke as well. Having my arse pressed up against Matty's keyboard and amp in the tiny Newcastle dressing room for the meet and greet is a memory I'll treasure forever, thanks again Waterline Man

DS stopped existing in 1982 and will of course never reunite, Agree on the second part, not so sure on the first. I wasn't a fan pre-82, but certainly since I've been a fan I've always seen DS as just being a vehicle for MK anyway

the ATTR tour was boring, Only thing that was boring was repeating too much of the 2005 tour, ie Bonaparte, Sonny Liston, So Far Away, Shangri La etc. The stuff from the new album and Emmylou's stuff sounded great

the original pensa suhr sounds crap live (even on You and your friend) and MK will never play it anymore because of its slim neck and I guess also because of its BMG pu's, Agreed, not TOO bad when played clean on Sultans and stuff, but no match for a real strat


Mk's music will become slower and slower... if I want to listen to rock, I will put on Making Movies or som other band than DS or MK. Dunno, it will probably plod along at mid-tempo... the important thing is that we keep getting new music.

[ds1984]

The interesting thing about the LOG album is that it was partially already played live before being recorded. My prefered although certainly not the most successful is the closing one.

I still think that studio album would be much better if the artist toured them before going to studio. First, song would have time to evolve, second weaker ones would be dropped. Can you imagine how HFB would have sounded if it had been recorded that way?
And SFA would have ended acoustic callypso on the BIA album.