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Author Topic: Bob's behaviour towards MK  (Read 39582 times)

surferboy

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Bob's behaviour towards MK
« on: October 22, 2012, 10:51:18 AM »
Dear fellow AMITers,

I have to get off my heart what makes me a little sad about this tour.

MK has done every contribution and compromise possible on his side to make this double header tour with the man he admires so much a good one:
he interrupted and postponed the recording of his album instead of suggesting a time frame when both artists would be free, he more than humbly accepted to go on stage first and leave Bob the prime spot (instead of interchanging every night), he then accepted to play a 70 minute set whereas Bob plays almost 90min. He thanks Bob during the shows for inviting him on "this little trip" whereas there is no word from Bob except at the last London show in 2011. And by agreeing to "open" for him in the US this year again, Mark relinquished his own US/Canada Tour plans for 2013!

From the diaries we konw, there is more going on behind the scenes, a good example beeing the soundcheck arrogance. Bob's soundcheck starts at 4pm and MK has only 30min at 6pm before doors open at 6.30pm. Also the use of the word "support act" is a more than offending term with respect to MK.

I know that this is standard BD behaviour when it comes to double bill tours with him (there are artists who never saw/met him during a joint tour), but Bob does know very well that Mark is far from being a second class support act. It hurts me because it hurts and offends Mark, the whole band and not to forget the US fans who will miss out on a proper full set Privateering Tour.

My thoughts are not so much meant as a Bob bashing but more as an expression of compassion with the MK camp, who try to make the best of this situation for the fans and for themselves and as an expression of the missed unique musical opportunities that the playing together of these two musical geniuses would be.

How do you feel about it?
« Last Edit: October 22, 2012, 03:30:07 PM by surferboy »

Offlinedmg

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2012, 11:18:22 AM »
Very well said.  I wouldn't worry about it though because Mark and the band keep each other good company and are clever enough to know it's only Krusty showing himself up.  I always say treat others as you would like to be treated and Mark does that in his shows by mentioning Krusty.  If that isn't reciprocated then it throws a bad light on only one man.
"I'm playing all the right notes, but not necessarily in the right order."

Offlineingridswing

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2012, 11:44:41 AM »
I agree with both of you. And I really think the MK-camp doesn't care much about it. They are gentleman and I can imagine them having a good laugh about this situation every now and then when driving by bus or sitting in the plane.

Offlinevgonis

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2012, 12:58:19 PM »
MK may not be the messiah or even a naughty boy, but he is certainly old enough to understand what's the deal and more present than us to the whole situation, to have the whole picture. So even though looks to get - a - lifers , but always outside people like us, can seem hurtful, I believe that we don't even know the truth or a two dimension version of it. It is an interesting topic however, because it reveals the real nice set of ethics AMITers have! So my 1 cent is that the issues mentioned could be valid. 
Come on, it is not funny anymore.

OfflineBanjo99uk

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2012, 01:33:58 PM »
Any respect I had for Krusty has gone. Just a total oddball.

Offlineanother brother

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2012, 01:38:06 PM »
Dylan is Dylan - i wouldn

Offlinetwm

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2012, 03:58:29 PM »
What is your evidence that Bob has been disrespectful to Mark on this tour?

These are simply your perceptions and you can surely state them here but they are just that and nothing more - perceptions. They seem to represent your own expectations rather than anything that is based in solid fact.

You could be right but I don't know and I suspect you don't know either. If you do have any inside knowledge, then please let us all know. I, for one, would very interested to learn.

I know I am addressing people who feel that Mark is "arrogant" and "stubborn" for not meeting their expectations in choosing to play what he wants to play in concert rather than what they would like to hear him play. That is more your problem than Mark's, I would suggest.

I am not saying that Dylan is above criticism (and he has certainly made decisions and taken courses of action that perplex me - and other Dylan fans, too) but there is simply no obligation on him to meet anyone else when on tour. Meeting people on tour or not doesn't make Dylan a nice person or otherwise, nor does it make him a good person or not. He has earned the respect of this writer ...

http://www.nctimes.com/entertainment/music/bob-dylan-at-like-a-rolling-stone/article_6148284f-fcfe-5946-a33a-25005404f742.html

... and, IMHO, he has earned the respect of many others - Mark included.  That is fact!




OfflineBanjo99uk

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2012, 04:09:05 PM »
Just because MK respects Dylan doesnt change my opinion that he appears to be a strange unlikeable man. Not the sort of person I would look up to, or for inspiration. Maybe fifty years in showbiz has frizzled more than his hair. I knew little about Emmylou Harris before her collaboration with MK. She carried herself with total dignity and came across as a nice person.

surferboy

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2012, 04:43:18 PM »
twm, I have always read with interest your contributions to this forum bringing a Dylan fan perspective to it.

It is not quite clear to me why you are asking for facts concerning Bob's rather disrespectful behavior towards MK.
I have named quite a few in my above post and if you are a reader of Guy's diary and his q&a forum it is simply not possible to not sense the puzzlement that is going on.

What else e.g. except arrogance and disregard is behind the daily soundcheck ritual that Bob is giving to one of the most respected guitarists and song writers in the world in leaving him, his band and crew just a few minutes of soundcheck time whereas he himself takes for his band all the time in the world. It is only due to the best of manners of our two diary writers that they do not call it for what it really is.

And it is good of Banjo to mention Emmy in this context. When Mark toured with her in 2006 and she was the one to be invited by Mark, the tour diary shows that she was treated like a queen. And she herself said during the tour, that the album and tour with Mark were her reward for 40 years of honest work in the music business. That's the way to treat an accomplished musician when you invite him to tour with you. It is unthinkable of BD to show just a glimpse of this kind of behavior.

twm, I do in no way question the outstanding musical genius of BD but his behavior is nothing else than ill.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2012, 04:57:58 PM by surferboy »

Offlinetwm

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #9 on: October 22, 2012, 05:21:45 PM »
It is not a question of whether Dylan is a nice person or not. I have no idea. Certainly, people I know who have met him in person say he is polite and pleasant. I dare say others will say differently. The question is whether he has been disrespectful to Mark

Dylan was arranging a tour and invited Mark to support him on that tour. The period set aside for the tour would have been clear at the time the invitation was made. Mark was free to accept or not. There was no pressure on him to do so and certainly no obligation.  The conditions relating to the tour (who played first and who played second, the rough time span for each performance, the money side and so on) would have been specified beforehand and, at some stage in the process, a formal contract would have been drawn up and signed by both of them or their authorised agents. There was likely to have been some (what we call in Britain) "to-ing and fro-ing" between both sides - a bit of negotiation and bargaining, before a deal was struck. A tour like this simply doesn't take place because two artists have a chat some time and think it would be a good idea. Whatever deal was struck, Dylan would have kept to his side (and Mark to his).

Whether Mark was preparing to record an album or to tour on his own account is irrelevant. He accepted the invitation and evevrything that goes with it.

In respect of Mark touring the USA on his own in support of PRIVATEERING, the album hasn't even been released there. Unlike Dylan, Mark generally tends not to tour other than when he has an album to promote, so I doubt he will go out on his own in the States until the record company problem is resolved. That's not a criticism and I would love to be proved wrong but it's just the way he does things. Dylan, on the other hand, by the end of this year, will have done something like 2600 concerts since 1986 and tours whether there's a new album out or not. Personally, I wish he had done fewer and had conserved his voice more but that's the way he does things. As I've said before, two performers, both good, who go about things in different ways.

So, Dylan hasn't acknowledged Mark during the concerts. Good grief, sometimes he doesn't even mention his band members by name. It may be a showbiz convention but it's not set in stone. Dylan just doesn't do that sort of stuff very often. He doesn't turn in a standard set of patter every time.  He doesn't tell the same jokes every night.  As I say, the two men are different - that's what makes it an interesting combination.

I don't read Guy's Q&A page very much at all (probably haven't looked at it in over 6 months) but I do look at the tour diaries every now and then. If you read the details, you will see that the timings of the two bands' travel arrangements are different. 
« Last Edit: October 23, 2012, 12:13:01 PM by twm »

Offlinesuperval99

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #10 on: October 22, 2012, 05:37:53 PM »
At the very least, it would be good manners, though, to give a "thank you" in return to MK for joining him on the tour, don't you think, twm?
Goin' into Tow Law....

Offlinevgonis

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2012, 06:20:18 PM »
I tend to agree with twm, for one reason only: If I was MK (humble and modest), and had this respect for Dylan, and was given the chance to play as support group, and meet him before or after the gigs and travel with him and be  invited on stage to play on some songs (OK not at this tour)  and so forth, I wouldn't care for the formalities of saying thank yous from stage.  As I have said before MK is not a little boy, he can take care of himself, and knows the drill. I wouldn't even bother to jump into conclusions, because there is no point in it, other than discussing it with fellow get-a-lifers. Of course, if the facts about rehearsal times are correct, it is a bit troubling and might explain some of the first performances, but I wouldn't go as far as interpreting it as Dylan looking down on our man.
Come on, it is not funny anymore.

Offlinegoon525

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2012, 06:37:06 PM »
I also tend to agree with twm. If MK didn't like what was involved in touring with BD when he did it in Europe last year, he was under no obligation to repeat the experience. Having said which it would seem at least common courtesy for Bob at least to introduce himself to Guy and the rest of the band at some point. They will have spent a lot of time on the road 'together' by the end of this tour.

Offlinevgonis

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #13 on: October 22, 2012, 06:47:36 PM »
BDs new album is fine. His voice is audible and you can clearly hear the lyrics without any aid. Why, oh why then his live recordings suffer so much? Maybe he had said thanks to our man, but we are unable to understand what he is saying... ;D
Come on, it is not funny anymore.

Offlinetwm

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Re: Bob's behaviour towards MK
« Reply #14 on: October 22, 2012, 06:56:56 PM »
Over the years, superval, I have written quite a few articles about Dylan and I have always tried really hard to give credit where credit is due. I regard that as right and proper. I also try to be respectful and mannerly in the way contribute to this forum and to express my views clearly and strongly without being unnecessarily rude or unpleasant.  So, you will not be surprised if I say that, had I become a performer and toured like Dylan, it is quite likely that I would have acknowledged all those touring with me. You and I may (indeed, do) regard that as "manners". I can only say that, if Dylan doesn't do it, it isn't out of disrespect for whoever is the support act.

Dylan has been known to "cold shoulder" people but he probably gets pestered and pursued a lot more than most other people. On the other hand, when meeting others, he is also known to be polite and pleasant, as I've said before - and I'm talking of people he has no need or particular reason to be polite with or pleasant to.

All his life, people have told him what they think he should do and how they think he should behave, the most famous (or perhaps infamous) being the "playing electric at a folk festival" in 1965 and the "Judas" incident of 1966. But it happened before then and it has continued since then.  He has simply ploughed his own furrow. I don't always like what I see and what I hear (both on-stage and off-stage) but he does it his way.

Oh a false clock tries to tick out my time
To disgrace, distract, and bother me
And the dirt of gossip blows into my face
And the dust of rumors covers me
But if the arrow is straight
And the point is slick
It can pierce through dust no matter how thick
So I

 

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